Help with my compact subwoofer

scott

A2OC Donor
Iv never had this problem before with normal amplifiers but with my vibe compact subwoofer with built in amp the power wire keeps melting its connector. After about 2 years of using it without problems it stopped working so I checked the wires and notice the big plus wire had melted the plastic connection, I just thought it was because it was a small connector

Here is a picture of the type of connection it did have origionaly I can't find the one that melted.
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This is one I bought from maplins to modify and and replace the melted one then I thought it might be easier to get rid of this connection all together and use a vibe "quick link" amp connecter in stead

All was good for about 6 months but for the last month the sub keeps turning on and off, Iv checked it today and I've noticed its melting this big connector!

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Can you see it starting to melt?

Can anyone help with why this is happening? And how to stop it??

Thanks for any help,

Scott
 
Now you've said that it's made me think, could it be a faulty earth? I conected it under one of the cargo straps so maybe that's come loose? I'll check it tomorrow anyway.
 
I checked the connections, I trimmed slightly and put new connectors on the earth wire and positive and still the positive wire is melting the connector plug :( any other ideas would be great. I've unplugged it at the moment incase it catches fire!!
 
Are the power and earth cables supplied with the Sub? Or were purchased separately?

Are they the right type for the power rating?

Is the fuse the correct rating?
 
I checked the connections, I trimmed slightly and put new connectors on the earth wire and positive and still the positive wire is melting the connector plug :( any other ideas would be great. I've unplugged it at the moment incase it catches fire!!
As mentioned above, you probably need thicker core wire, the thin wire you are using is acting like a heater! Too much resistance.

To see if that really is the cause before you spend money on thicker core cable, try using the same wire that you have used, but use two lengths of it to effectively double the core size.

If that stops it then you will know the cause.

Steve B
 
Thanks for your help, the wire I'm using is from a kit from Halfords cost about £20-£30 I have used this kit with 1000w amps before and it's been fine? I did get a amp wiring kit with the subwoofer, I didn't bother using it because I already had the Halfords wiring kit installed, also the Halfords wiring kit seems thicker than the vibe kit supplied? I'll try your suggestions and see if it fixes it. The was a 25 amp fuse fitted to the wiring kit a while back I blew the 20 amp fuse and all I had was a 25 amp fuse to replace it, could this be a problem?

Thanks

Scott
 
Here are the wires vibe supplied. The yellow is the + and the black is obviously the - the red wire is a cut off off the + I'm using at the moment and it a fair bit thicker.

image.jpg

image.jpg
 
The was a 25 amp fuse fitted to the wiring kit a while back I blew the 20 amp fuse and all I had was a 25 amp fuse to replace it, could this be a problem?

Thanks

Scott

That worries me a bit, if it has blown a 20amp fuse and melts the plastic on the wiring, something serious could be wrong.

If that is the correct wire for that amp then there is definitely a problem.

Please, for safety, have an auto electrician check it out.

Wiring fires can write off a car !! (not to mention the danger to the occupants)

Just trying to give some safety advice.

Steve B
 
Electrical wiring getting warm is usually caused by either excessive current draw on an inadequate conductor cross section or a poor connection/dry joint leading to a high resistance.

In both instances you should carefully examine the wiring and confirm that its capable of handling the demand with some safety factor. There is a formula to work out exactly what you need. Also, always buy the best quality within your budget.

blue skies
tony
 
That worries me a bit, if it has blown a 20amp fuse and melts the plastic on the wiring, something serious could be wrong.

If that is the correct wire for that amp then there is definitely a problem.

Please, for safety, have an auto electrician check it out.

Wiring fires can write off a car !! (not to mention the danger to the occupants)

Just trying to give some safety advice.

Steve B

Sorry my post was unclear, the system never blew or melted the fuse holder, I blew the fuse when I remove the sub from the car I also remove the fuse from the fuse holder to kill the live feed. When putting the fuse back in It blew, I think due to it being fidley and not getting it in the holder 1st time. Once it blew I only had a 25 amp fuse to replace the blown 20 amp fuse.
Yesterday I removed the red Halfords live wire and fit the yellow + wire vibe supplied. I also checked the earth wire and re fit that and so far so good. I'll keep an eye on it now.

Thanks
 
Electrical wiring getting warm is usually caused by ... high resistance.

High resistance inhibits the flow of current. Therefore, given that the supply voltage isn't changing, high resistance cannot be the cause of a melted connector.

Scott, it's possible that there's an internal fault in the amp that's triggered when the amp gets warm from use, thus leading to the somewhat intermittent nature of the fault. Keep an eye on it and report back. Hopefully we'll spot a pattern.

Tom
 
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Thanks timmus, on long journeys after about an hour and a half to two hours of fairly loud music the sub would cut out for about 30 seconds or so and keep doing so until it had cools down, but I never noticed the melting connectors then but maybe I wasn't looking for it. Since Iv changed the power wire it's been fine, I did notice the wire that they supplied is exactly the same thickness as the wire coming out of the amp, the old red Halfords wire I was using was nearly double the thickness. Since changing the wires I haven't been in the car with the music on for more than half an hour so it hasn't had a great test yet.

Thanks for you input
 
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I found the origional plug that melted on the amp, on this it seemed the earth lead got hot I thought it was because I connected the two yellow plus wires but only 1 of the 2 earth wires (I don't know a great deal about wiring but I'm learning and interested)

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When this melted it seemed easier to take it out and use the main wires that were soldered to it

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I then used a "vibe fast plug" to connect these wires to the amp wiring kit in the car

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If I were you I would be worried and get this checked out properly.

It could be a multitude of things and being as you said you don't know a great deal about wiring, you need to find someone to sort this problem.

Looking at the state of that wiring I am guessing you have a poor earth connection, what is your remote switched wire hooked to, please tell me it's not permanent?

Your fuse shouldn't blow because you didn't locate it straight away, more problems?

It could just be a faulty amp but that wiring needs to be checked, do you have any shorts? Damaged wiring?

I did 8 years in ICE and saw some awful sights and also many dangerous sights. A number of cars and equipment burnt out due to dangerous installation.

If your car goes up in smoke due to poor installation of aftermarket audio equipment that you haven't told your car insurance company about they will probably not pay out......
 
Hi thank you for your advice, I think the fuse blew that time because the radio was on when I put the fuse in and when power is on is causes a small spark when connecting it and I didn't get it in first time?? The blue wire is connected to the radio so it's not on constantly. I think the white connector melted the way it did due to the way I wired it up, and it caused a resistance because there was a thicker gauge + and a very thin - ? I had both yellow + wires going in to the amp but for some silly reason that I can't remember I only used the one black - when there should have been two to provide the same amount of power and earth? The second time it melted whilst the fast plug was installed I don't understand but now I've changed the wiring kit it seems to be ok so far. But your right and I will at some point take it to a car audio shop to have a look at it.
 
Electrical wiring getting warm is usually caused by either excessive current draw on an inadequate conductor cross section or a poor connection/dry joint leading to a high resistance.

In both instances you should carefully examine the wiring and confirm that its capable of handling the demand with some safety factor. There is a formula to work out exactly what you need. Also, always buy the best quality within your budget.

blue skies
tony

The above statement is correct in every sense.

High resistance inhibits the flow of current. Therefore, given that the supply voltage isn't changing, high resistance cannot be the cause of a melted connector.

Tom

Automotive electrical circuits are designed and specified in accordance with the current draw of the consumers been powered. The greater the current draw, the thicker the wire must be. Consider the difference in conductor thickness between battery cables and those of an average stereo head system.

Laws of physics determine that the resistance of a wire varies based on its physical thickness – the thinner the wire, the higher its resistance. Thicker wires must be used to accommodate a higher current. The cross-sectional area of a wire is inversely proportional to its resistance – if the wire is doubled in thickness, then its resistance is halved. Using thinner wire to support large current draw will result in the wire heating up and eventually melting both itself and its connector housing as well as possible damage to the consumer it is connected to.
Clear evidence of “hot” wiring can be found in a car cigarette lighter which uses a high resistance coil to glow red hot by applying a high current. The lighter pop’s-out when heat sensitive tabs within its body expand and release the lighter which then begins to cool. Another example is by using thin cables to jump start a car will result in the cables getting hot – hence the use of substantially thick cables!

The weak link in any electrical circuit is the physical integrity of its terminations – the connectors. Connectors are not only subject to vibrations and periodic handling, but the connection itself deteriorates over time and begins to oxidise. A connection that is not mechanically tight will begin a failure process that will increase its resistance and consequently will increase in heat. As this process continues, the joint will become less tight, higher in resistance and hotter. As this cycle continues, the joint will attain a sufficiently high temperature that will damage the connector housing and the conductor itself. This will also have the effect of sporadic operation of the consumer. Good electrical connections are made by solid mechanical crimping methods and using terminals rated for the current being applied. It may come as a surprise to many that a fusible link will not detect a high resistance and overheated wiring, and will not protect the circuit until there is a short circuit as a result of heat damage, which by then is probably too late.

To work out the correct wire thickness (gauge) we need to know the current (Amps) draw for the consumer. Using Watts’s law;
I = W/V or current = watts/volts
A typical headlamp rated at 60 W will require approximately 5 Amps.
I = 60/12, therefore, I = 5Amps
Using this formula, we can now specify the correct AWG (American Wire Gauge) for the conductor.

Note please that the VOLTAGE always remains constant in a typical automotive application at 13.2Volts – commonly rounded to 12Volts.

Providing a secondary wire to an electrical circuit in parallel may allow for some current drain but as electricity flows down the route of least resistance (much like water), it is likely that the bulk of the current will travel via the shorter wire.

I hope this helps and addresses misconceptions surrounding basic electrical principles.

blue skies
tony
 
Tom,

In my thirty years experience of high current dc electrics, a poor connection invariably leads to heat, a lot of it, and damage to the surrounding components.

If this isn't due to 'high resistance' please educate me on the cause. Never to old to learn.

Kind regards

Nick
 
Not sure if they are fact or fiction but there are a couple of 'electrical' things which have stuck in my mind over the years -

Heat produced in an electrical component / wiring etc is proportional to current squared. Heat is a big problem in overhead power cables due to expansion and sag so that's the reason they run at 44000 volts but very low amps.
Bad connections increase resistance (poor crimps, broken wire strands, loose connectors) which can cause a voltage drop. As above, the power demand (watts) of the hardware stays the same so as the voltage drops, the amps go up.
A basic example -
120W component in a 12v circuit is drawing 10 amps
Voltage drops to 10v so current increases to 12 amps
Heat is proportional to current squared so increases from the base (10 squared) to (12 squared) which is almost 50% increase, probably enough to melt a fuse or overheat a connector block


Cheers Spike
 
I have bought a new connector and so far so good I chose this connector because I couldn't think of anything els to use and the clear casing will help me keep an eye on it if it starts to melt

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