Electric cabin heater

sco

A2OC Donor
Do all TDi's have either a diesel powered auxiliary heater or the electric heater? I have an 05 plate Special Edition so believe I should have the electric heater but not really noticed instant heat - I've tried ECON off but is there some other prerequisite like outside temperature below 5degrees? I had a look in the fusebox by the drivers knee - there is an empty slot labelled additional heating 30A/20A which sounds hopeful but the slot won't accept a fuse like there are no electrical connections behind the slot.

Simon.
 
The earlier model A2.s had the webasto pre heater which sat in the engine bay on the left hand side in front of the brake fluid reservoir. Later models didnt have it and like my 2004 - it takes around seven minutes into a journey before any heat comes through. Perhaps the "missing fuse" is a redundant relic from the previous webasto fitting.

Its like us a bit - we have an appendix but its no longer any use :)

Ta
Dave
:)
 
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Yours will be electric heater, econ off his for aircon on, press demisster on cabin warms quicker.
 
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Doing a search there are several similar threads - it's like searching for the holy grail - nobody seems to know quite if the heater exists or how to tell if it's working or not :)

Simon.
 
Found this on the electric heater element( sorry I could not find a plain english version) -


The engine control unit switches on the additional heater if e.g. the following preconditions are met:

t The operating and display unit for air conditioner/Climatronic -E87- transmits a request via the convenience data bus, or the heater control electronics have switched the input to earth (the Econ button is not pressed, the ambient temperature is below 6 °C).

t Engine speed greater than 600 rpm

t The coolant temperature is less than 70 °C (or less than 80 °C at very low ambient temperatures).

Cheers Spike
 
Spike,

Thanks that's helpful - need to wait for the temperature to drop a bit then!

Simon.
 
Found a few other requirements for operation from the workshop manual;

Test requirements:
t The engine is at ambient temperature (the coolant temperature is lower than 50 °C at the start of the test).
t There is no fault saved in the engine control unit and in the operating and display unit for air conditioner/Climatronic -E87- → Chapter and → Relevant Workshop Manual, Diesel Direct Injection and Glow Plug System
t Depending on the vehicle features, the following is set:
– On the operating and display unit for air conditioner/Climatronic -E87- in vehicles with air conditioning: - Target temperature greater than 28 °C (e.g. “Hi”) - “Auto” mode (not “Econ”)
– When the heater is activated in vehicles with a heater system: - Temperature rotary knob turned fully to “Warm” - Rotary knob for the fresh-air blower set to speed “3” - and with the Econ button not pressed (if there is one)
t Additional consumers (e.g. heated rear window, heated seats) are switched off.

And;

Checking actuation of additional heater by engine control unit:
– With the ignition off, connect the vehicle diagnostic, testing and information system -VAS 5051- by the diagnostic cable -VAS 5051/5A-, for example, to the 16-pin diagnostic socket in the vehicle → Chapter.
– Spray the sender for the ambient temperature sensor -G17- (installed in the area of the front bumper → Chapter) at an ambient temperature above 5 °C continuously with a cold spray until the sender drops below -10 °C.
– Switch on the ignition.
– Set the maximum heat output on the heater control or the operating and display unit for air conditioner/Climatronic -E87- (with the Econ button not pressed, the rotary knob for temperature preselection set fully to “heat” or temperature preselection “Hi”).
– Start the engine and select the display group intended for this function in the measured value block in the engine control unit (depending on the engine control unit, e.g. display group “016”) → Relevant Workshop Manual, Diesel Direct Injection and Glow Plug System
– Increase the engine speed to approx. 2000 rpm and monitor the display for actuation of the electric additional heater.
Read out the display group with the shut-off criteria for the electric additional heater in the engine control unit measured value block.

So I think you need the following conditions;

Outside temp below 5degrees
Econ button off
Heater set to max
No other significant electrical load (rear window off)
Engine rpm above idling speed.

So although more efficient at heating the cabin than the diesel powered heater it probably won't work when the windows are all frosted up as the rear heater will be on and the rpm will be too low.

Simon.
 
I cheated mine into life to check it was working the other week with an ice pole,
just look through the lower front bumper grill, youl see the outside temp sensor, wedge the ice pole on there and hey presto -5 displayed and when you fire the car up everything should work as its ment to or youv a problem, I found the heater was toasty after about 3 miles and say 5 or so minutes like dave suggested.

Gary

note my TDI has the webasto fitted and the large alloy electric heater inside the interior heater itself near the cabin filter
 
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Was that a retro fit then to have both diesel and electric heater? Have wondered about fitting a webasto and an ewp so can be used as a parking heater.

Smon.
 
I wouldnt like to say as the dash had been out before, just wish they knew what they wer doing, i dare say its standard as who ever it was did not have the brains to attempt such a task or anything thinking about it.
 
Hi Gary,

Are you sure the electric heater has been retrofitted? The interior fan is near to the cabin filter, could it be this? As your car is listed as MY2001, it should only have the Webasto heater.

Regards,

Matt.
 
Thats my 1.4 petrol, the one im speaking of is fitted in my 2002 1.4 TDI and its no fan, ive had it all apart to fix the breakages and bodges its just next to the fan housing as such inbetween that and the cabin filter, hears a pic of the outside and you can see the wiring going into the top of it. the alloy heating fins are about 5 inches long and 3 inches square in shape at its base and go from the top of the casing down to near the bottom to heat the air as it passes through.


IMG_0747.JPG

As to been retrofitted i doubt it but can not say 100% for sure.
 
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That picture makes no sense, as ones the aircon rad and the others the normal cooling systems cabin heater matrix, nothing like what my TDI has installed
 
That picture makes no sense, as ones the aircon rad and the others the normal cooling systems cabin heater matrix, nothing like what my TDI has installed

Early TDIs had the Webasto heater near the front offside wheel tub. It burns diesel via a glowplug to heat the coolant.
They then switched (sometime around 2002 I think) to an electric heating element within the aircon/heating system.

So perhaps yours is an early TDI or perhaps you haven't stripped down the heating system and haven't seen the electric heater mechanism.

Steve B
 
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Early TDIs had the Webasto heater near the front offside wheel tub. It burns diesel via a glowplug to heat the coolant.
They then switched (sometime around 2002 I think) to an electrict heating element within the aircon/heating system.

So perhaps yours is an early TDI or perhaps you haven't stripped down the heating system and haven't seen the electric heater mechanism.

Steve B

Hi steve,
thinks everyones confused u as Sco who has an issue and not myself,

My A2 has both the webasto and the electric heater, althow not like the one pictured, maybe as mine was on the change it got both, lucky me !! as gets ever so toasty in minutes now, ive also got AC :);)

Gary
 
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Think the heater kicked in this morning - outside temp was about 4degrees so set heater to 29degrees and within a minute or so warmish air was blowing out of the vents. :)

Simon.
 
Think the heater kicked in this morning - outside temp was about 4degrees so set heater to 29degrees and within a minute or so warmish air was blowing out of the vents. :)

Simon.

The best thing to do with the temperature setting is to leave it alone and just run with the same temperature setting (perhaps increasing it a degree or two in winter time)

Increasing it on start up and then decreasing it again when it is warm doesn't actua;l;y make a difference.

The system ill not start pushing out air in any volume until the water temperature has risen sufficiently. The reason is that there is no point in circulating cold air!

So if you leave it at your normal setting, the system will start pushing out warm air when it can regardless of the setting (if you have set a "normal" temperature.

This is one of the reasons why the soft touch buttons wear so rapidly.

I can honestly say that I only change the temperature twice a year, once in winter t up the overall temperature a couple of degrees and then once again in summer to revert back.

I can see why people want to get warm air as son as possible, but the car is quite clever andwon't blow out cold air unless you manually set it to do so (such as the front screen defrost).

I am not saying that there is a right or wrong way, I am merly suggesting that constantly changing the temperature up and then down every day may well be having no efect.

By the way if you ever wondered what the difference is between "Air Conditioning" and "Climate control" effectively it i as I described above.

With "Air conditioning" the temperature does not automatically adjust, you can set the "Air con" to cold and it will stay cold all the time, it will not maintain a set temperature.

No A2 has "Air Conditioning" they all have either "Climate control", or just plain heating (Circular controls on the heater dash) However, climate control uses airconditioning as well, but just automatically.


Steve B
 
Steve,

I would tend to agree apart from that flies in the face of what is in the workshop manual;

Test requirements:
t The engine is at ambient temperature (the coolant temperature is lower than 50 °C at the start of the test).
t There is no fault saved in the engine control unit and in the operating and display unit for air conditioner/Climatronic -E87- → Chapter and → Relevant Workshop Manual, Diesel Direct Injection and Glow Plug System
t Depending on the vehicle features, the following is set:
On the operating and display unit for air conditioner/Climatronic -E87- in vehicles with air conditioning: - Target temperature greater than 28 °C (e.g. “Hi”) - “Auto” mode (not “Econ”)
– When the heater is activated in vehicles with a heater system: - Temperature rotary knob turned fully to “Warm” - Rotary knob for the fresh-air blower set to speed “3” - and with the Econ button not pressed (if there is one)
t Additional consumers (e.g. heated rear window, heated seats) are switched off.

And;

Checking actuation of additional heater by engine control unit:
– With the ignition off, connect the vehicle diagnostic, testing and information system -VAS 5051- by the diagnostic cable -VAS 5051/5A-, for example, to the 16-pin diagnostic socket in the vehicle → Chapter.
– Spray the sender for the ambient temperature sensor -G17- (installed in the area of the front bumper → Chapter) at an ambient temperature above 5 °C continuously with a cold spray until the sender drops below -10 °C.
– Switch on the ignition.
Set the maximum heat output on the heater control or the operating and display unit for air conditioner/Climatronic -E87- (with the Econ button not pressed, the rotary knob for temperature preselection set fully to “heat” or temperature preselection “Hi”).
– Start the engine and select the display group intended for this function in the measured value block in the engine control unit (depending on the engine control unit, e.g. display group “016”) → Relevant Workshop Manual, Diesel Direct Injection and Glow Plug System
– Increase the engine speed to approx. 2000 rpm and monitor the display for actuation of the electric additional heater.
Read out the display group with the shut-off criteria for the electric additional heater in the engine control unit measured value block.
 
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