1.4 petrol low torque pedal response

Joga

Member
Hi,
I am a bit annoyed by a phenomena in my BBY 1.4 petrol but have little luck in finding useful information on this when searching both internet in general and A2OC in particular.
The phenomena: I find it a bit hard to drive smoothly in speeds like 20-25mph, with engine rpm like 1500-2000 when the engine net torque is near to zero, or even change sign. Either I get an abrupt switch from positive torque to negative torque (engine brake), or vice versa when I want to leave negative torque; I get an abrupt step up to a significant positive torque.
So eg it is difficult to drive nicely in city environment with cars in front of me that slightly change their speed and to which I have to maintain my distance to.

As a first step, if someone could someone offer advice over useful search terms in English to hopefully get me closer to any related information in my search, I would be most grateful.
 

Jeff Sutcliffe

A2OC Donor
Hi,
I am a bit annoyed by a phenomena in my BBY 1.4 petrol but have little luck in finding useful information on this when searching both internet in general and A2OC in particular.
The phenomena: I find it a bit hard to drive smoothly in speeds like 20-25mph, with engine rpm like 1500-2000 when the engine net torque is near to zero, or even change sign. Either I get an abrupt switch from positive torque to negative torque (engine brake), or vice versa when I want to leave negative torque; I get an abrupt step up to a significant positive torque.
So eg it is difficult to drive nicely in city environment with cars in front of me that slightly change their speed and to which I have to maintain my distance to.

As a first step, if someone could someone offer advice over useful search terms in English to hopefully get me closer to any related information in my search, I would be most grateful.
It sounds as though you are trying to drive in too high a gear. Try dropping a gear when you're in heavy traffic such as you describe. Second and third gears are probably the most useful gears in the circumstances you describe.
 

Kleynie

A2OC Donor
The lack of torque is especially noticeable down in the lower revs and takes a while to get used to, or at least it did for me, but I do manage to drive fairly smoothly more often now. I know what you mean about the quick shift in torque as well, you move the pedal the slightest amount and it starts engine braking. I partially fixed this by cleaning the throttle body and giving her fresh coil packs, it's still there, but much less noticeable now.
 

Jmywil

Member
Our 2001 1.4SE bought from new had a similar throttle action, acted like a switch at low revs, on or off and hard to modulate. Made it difficult to drive smoothly in traffic at low speed, like there was a slight delay between pressing the peddle and the signal getting through. Not sure it’s common to all as when I had a 1.4 sport courtesy car it was much better. Is it a fly-by-wire/digital throttle, software upgrade? Don't take this as definitive as we sold that car in 2005, but thought it might help if it’s describing the same issue.
 

Joga

Member
Thanks for the comments, I was just hoping for ideas for search terms.
Too high a gear, yes could be, but with almost zero torque I am thinking the driveability should be better. And the rev is still not near idle so should behave better.
Throttle cleaning, hmm, might try that.
In the german forum I have found information that the engine control unit can be updated, but a bit unclear was issues it could solve.
Br Joakim
 

TYP 8Z

Member
Thanks for the comments, I was just hoping for ideas for search terms.
Too high a gear, yes could be, but with almost zero torque I am thinking the driveability should be better. And the rev is still not near idle so should behave better.
Throttle cleaning, hmm, might try that.
In the german forum I have found information that the engine control unit can be updated, but a bit unclear was issues it could solve.
Br Joakim
I too read somewhere that an update for 1.4 petrol CCU is available....would be interesting to find out more
 

bretti_kivi

Member
that update is not for the CCCU / KSG, it's for the engine ECU / MSG. And it's not necessarily available any more, maybe through a dealer if you're lucky. It was / is an online update and therefore subject to availability.
One way around it is to drive with 98 Octane. The issue is generally solves is driveability, especially when it's warm and you have climate on and demand lots from the engine at low speeds. I nearly stalled mine many times. I think I have the update, I don't remember..

Lots more information here: https://a2-freun.de/forum/forums/topic/41933-motorsteuergerät-updatethread/page/5/?tab=comments#comment-553989

- Bret
 

Joga

Member
Ah, so that update might not be the silver bullret for this particular on-off phenomena near zero torque then.
Is there a known theory on how 98 octan could improve this, it would be a nice and easy solution if it does the job.
 

Edwrai

Member
Ah, so that update might not be the silver bullret for this particular on-off phenomena near zero torque then.
Is there a known theory on how 98 octan could improve this, it would be a nice and easy solution if it does the job.
I don’t think octan makes a difference our older 1.4 did this and was alway ran on 99 Ron. Our newer 1.4 does this a bit less but still does it. Older one was easy to kangaroo due to this


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EamonnDH

Member
Definitely curious of any solutions, my 1.4 is a pain to get moving from standstill when warm. Plus the on/off behaviour for the first third of the pedal travel is really annoying, makes it difficult to take off properly without stalling or revving like mad!

It is also definitely quite sleepy below 3k RPM, but it's not too bad. Currently on 99ron, will try some regular stuff to see if it's worse.
 

steve_c

A2OC Donor
Definitely curious of any solutions, my 1.4 is a pain to get moving from standstill when warm. Plus the on/off behaviour for the first third of the pedal travel is really annoying, makes it difficult to take off properly without stalling or revving like mad!

It is also definitely quite sleepy below 3k RPM, but it's not too bad. Currently on 99ron, will try some regular stuff to see if it's worse.

Well my AUA has none of this. It's quite happy to pull away with no throttle whatever, and the low end torque is more than adequate for driving in everyday conditions.

I replaced the entire exhaust, including the rear cat; before that it had been even more asthmatic than I am.
 

hotdog1

Member
Does anyone on the forum have access to the later software?

I have read on the German forum that members took there cars to dealers to get the ECU reflashed to the latest version but we as the UK seem distinctly behind our euro cousins !

I think with the age of the cars now it is really important to get this point looked into....
 

Edwrai

Member
Does anyone on the forum have access to the later software?

I have read on the German forum that members took there cars to dealers to get the ECU reflashed to the latest version but we as the UK seem distinctly behind our euro cousins !

I think with the age of the cars now it is really important to get this point looked into....
Yeah I would like this I have a bby which is running fine but would be good to have


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Sylvester

Member
I experience nothing like self-braking at low rpm on my 1.4 AUA, or such low torque issue which make driving in cities a headache, although changing gears at 1500/rpm sounds way too low, you need a car around 2L engine to have enough torque enabling shifting smoothly that low rpm.
I've tested how changing gears mostly around 2000rpm AND 2500-3000rpm, which makes driving faster for sure, changes the MPG and with same amount of fuel, instead of 130 miles, I got 120 miles. So the difference of course is there, but not by much, so if you change gears at 1.5k/rpm to save fuel, just shift rather around 2k, the engine will be much smoother as well.
 

Edwrai

Member
I experience nothing like self-braking at low rpm on my 1.4 AUA, or such low torque issue which make driving in cities a headache, although changing gears at 1500/rpm sounds way too low, you need a car around 2L engine to have enough torque enabling shifting smoothly that low rpm.
I've tested how changing gears mostly around 2000rpm AND 2500-3000rpm, which makes driving faster for sure, changes the MPG and with same amount of fuel, instead of 130 miles, I got 120 miles. So the difference of course is there, but not by much, so if you change gears at 1.5k/rpm to save fuel, just shift rather around 2k, the engine will be much smoother as well.
It’s all down to gearing really and the engine itself, my 1.6 avy in my yellow a2 has a 6 speed box and the gears are very close to the 1.4 you can drive this on tickover almost in all gears


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Providence

A2OC Donor
I've got a 1.4 Sport and checked the other day and it accelerated (not quick but acceptably) from 800RPM in 4th. It's a BBY and been running on VPower 99 for 21 months. I have put 2 coilpacks in it (Sep 18) and replaced all the plugs in May 2019. I haven't reset the DIS since May 19 and it's averaging 38.8 MPG on mainly urban driving. I don't try hard to get the best MPG because I enjoy 'giving it some' ;0) I never turn the AC off.

I had a 1.4 TDI before but I like this car better to drive.
 

hotdog1

Member
But wouldn't it be better knowing the latest software update fixed potential flaws when the engine becomes older, allows smoother take off from standing and some other improvements that are a little less obvious...
 

hotdog1

Member
MARELLI 4MV G 4637

I believe the latest is Marcelli 4MV 5246

Thread resurection but some members had their software updated ten years ago ! If i could cure the frustration that comes when pulling away it would greatly improve the car...

 
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