A plea to members from an FSI owner, a long-standing A2OC'er and Admin Member

D

Darren C

Admin Team
Evening troop,

I’d like to start by saying that I am not without a sense of humour nor am I biased toward a particular engine type in the A2, having had three variations in the family over the course of time. I’m penning this not in defence of my own A2, but broader, in the interests of those who own or aspire (yes) to own an FSI.

When I joined this wonderful club in 2005 with my TDI special edition, the family friendly atmosphere that predominantly remains today was the entirety of the club. There was no snobbery about what specification of A2 you owned, no penalty for owning a derivative other than a TDI, the ownership experience and club solidarity was centred on the car. I’ve since seen a distinct and very unsavoury swing against this club ethos.

The FSI was Audi’s first attempt at innovative fuel saving technology in a petrol engine. Yes, it is far from perfect, or reliable, the facts are the facts. I’d not advocate anything but the reality. If someone was looking for a reliable, cheap to run daily, I’d not champion the FSI personally. That said, a good running FSI is a pleasure, smooth and efficient and with good economy and reasonable power on tap too. In many respects the pioneering FSI suits the pioneering A2.

So, back to the point in hand. Presenting the facts about the FSIs many problems in a measured balanced way, as is duly exercised with the TDI 90, dual mass flywheel and variable vane turbo against the power, performance and economy, is fair and on point. To berate consistently in a manner that may make owners of such cars feel less-valued amongst the club following, falls well below the kindness that the club is renowned for. Sadly this is more of a constant on this forum now.

I fear such actions might also put off new members who have joined for advice and counsel and who are met with derogatory remarks from such a loyal following.

This thread is a plea in effect. We all share the passion that is the A2, we are all here because we love the A2 and in equal measure we all love our own cars. This applies whether a base car or a fully loaded model and/or regardless of which of the five engine choices are hidden beneath the removable bonnet.

All derivatives deserve to be cherished and all deserve to wear the A2 badge. In equal measure, all deserve our respect.

I’m asking that the club pull together here and help to make the A2 ownership and classic car status fun for all and a reality for all.

Darren
 
Darren C said:
Evening troop,

I’d like to start by saying that I am not without a sense of humour nor am I biased toward a particular engine type in the A2, having had three variations in the family over the course of time. I’m penning this not in defence of my own A2, but broader, in the interests of those who own or aspire (yes) to own an FSI.

When I joined this wonderful club in 2005 with my TDI special edition, the family friendly atmosphere that predominantly remains today was the entirety of the club. There was no snobbery about what specification of A2 you owned, no penalty for owning a derivative other than a TDI, the ownership experience and club solidarity was centred on the car. I’ve since seen a distinct and very unsavoury swing against this club ethos.

The FSI was Audi’s first attempt at innovative fuel saving technology in a petrol engine. Yes, it is far from perfect, or reliable, the facts are the facts. I’d not advocate anything but the reality. If someone was looking for a reliable, cheap to run daily, I’d not champion the FSI personally. That said, a good running FSI is a pleasure, smooth and efficient and with good economy and reasonable power on tap too. In many respects the pioneering FSI suits the pioneering A2.

So, back to the point in hand. Presenting the facts about the FSIs many problems in a measured balanced way, as is duly exercised with the TDI 90, dual mass flywheel and variable vane turbo against the power, performance and economy, is fair and on point. To berate consistently in a manner that may make owners of such cars feel less-valued amongst the club following, falls well below the kindness that the club is renowned for. Sadly this is more of a constant on this forum now.

I fear such actions might also put off new members who have joined for advice and counsel and who are met with derogatory remarks from such a loyal following.

This thread is a plea in effect. We all share the passion that is the A2, we are all here because we love the A2 and in equal measure we all love our own cars. This applies whether a base car or a fully loaded model and/or regardless of which of the five engine choices are hidden beneath the removable bonnet.

All derivatives deserve to be cherished and all deserve to wear the A2 badge. In equal measure, all deserve our respect.

I’m asking that the club pull together here and help to make the A2 ownership and classic car status fun for all and a reality for all.

Darren
Click to expand...
Hi Darren,
I for one wholeheartedly agree with your sentiments in this post.
Regards
Keith.
 
Darren C said:
Evening troop,

I’d like to start by saying that I am not without a sense of humour nor am I biased toward a particular engine type in the A2, having had three variations in the family over the course of time. I’m penning this not in defence of my own A2, but broader, in the interests of those who own or aspire (yes) to own an FSI.

When I joined this wonderful club in 2005 with my TDI special edition, the family friendly atmosphere that predominantly remains today was the entirety of the club. There was no snobbery about what specification of A2 you owned, no penalty for owning a derivative other than a TDI, the ownership experience and club solidarity was centred on the car. I’ve since seen a distinct and very unsavoury swing against this club ethos.

The FSI was Audi’s first attempt at innovative fuel saving technology in a petrol engine. Yes, it is far from perfect, or reliable, the facts are the facts. I’d not advocate anything but the reality. If someone was looking for a reliable, cheap to run daily, I’d not champion the FSI personally. That said, a good running FSI is a pleasure, smooth and efficient and with good economy and reasonable power on tap too. In many respects the pioneering FSI suits the pioneering A2.

So, back to the point in hand. Presenting the facts about the FSIs many problems in a measured balanced way, as is duly exercised with the TDI 90, dual mass flywheel and variable vane turbo against the power, performance and economy, is fair and on point. To berate consistently in a manner that may make owners of such cars feel less-valued amongst the club following, falls well below the kindness that the club is renowned for. Sadly this is more of a constant on this forum now.

I fear such actions might also put off new members who have joined for advice and counsel and who are met with derogatory remarks from such a loyal following.

This thread is a plea in effect. We all share the passion that is the A2, we are all here because we love the A2 and in equal measure we all love our own cars. This applies whether a base car or a fully loaded model and/or regardless of which of the five engine choices are hidden beneath the removable bonnet.

All derivatives deserve to be cherished and all deserve to wear the A2 badge. In equal measure, all deserve our respect.

I’m asking that the club pull together here and help to make the A2 ownership and classic car status fun for all and a reality for all.

Darren
Click to expand...
Good evening Darren, as a (quite) long standing member and owner of a 2001 'cat C' TDI 75 upon which I have spent several thousands of pounds on maintenance, repairs and servicing over my five years of ownership, I suppose I ought to apologise for not getting involved when other TDI and 1.4 petrol owners have made what you perceive to have been derogatory and unflattering comments about the FSI. Unless an A2 owner is either very fortunate, or a skilled mechanic and/or auto electrician, running any 14+ years old car as a daily driver is almost bound to be an expensive venture. However, you only have to read some of the posts on the 'other' Facebook A2 group to realise that, for many owners, A2s are merely perceived as cheap run arounds to be scrapped when any problems arise, rather than the 'classic in the making' that you and I and the majority of the long standing forum members do. I understand your concern about some of the remarks made in relation to the FSI but believe that they have only been made light heartedly or as cautionary advice when newer members ask about potential ownership or new acquisitions. The truth is that any A2 can be a money pit and I should have perhaps said that on the occasions that you have identified. My only reason for not doing so is my belief that the advice and comments have been made in what the advisers/commentators consider to be the best interests of those FSI owners who do not share the group's 'addiction' to our A2s. If proof were needed, I only have to read the encouragement given to Louis!
 
Not sure if theres been any posts that ive missed that may have gone to far but to me justs seems like a bit of light hearted banter and not to be taken to seriously.
This banter is replicated on other forums, R32oc has similar on whether the mk4 is better than the mk5 etc.
 
Think I may need to put an alternate view to the FSI.........firstly I feel they can be a nightmare and a very deep money pit.......but so can any older car with tech based running gear and power unit........I can name at least 2 other Audi's with problems that cause owners to fill the forums with tales of woe firstly the Haldex diff unit and also the auto gearbox fitted to both the A4 b6/7.....there are many many more
Luckily most faults with the FSI are well known and documented unfortunately they are all expensive to repair
1, "the Death Pipe"........come to that any coolant leak it all goes wrong very quickly and usually leads to a seriously overheated engine....Big Bill
2 Manifold flaps...........again due in part to the high engine temps carbon build up in the manifold leads to a broken actuator and EML.......Big Bill
3 Fuel injectors...........again in part to the injector in head design and high temps the injectors can clog over time and the seals degrade.......Big Bill
4 Thermostat........ controlled by the ECU to enable high engine temps sadly the plastic housing becomes fragile over time and leaks......Big Bill
The above perhaps reflect why the FSI gets a bad name and is unloved by many....unless you're in the position to carry out repairs cheaply yourself or are prepared to pay the Big Bills then most would be wise to stay away....a shame as in general they are a great car "Top of the Range" and in many ways the car to hanker for...
I feel that many non forum owners have bought cars without research and when they go wrong come here for answers only to learn of the problems the cars suffer and of course feel done either by the last owner or the lack of simple "cheap" repairs..
I'm sure many here would agree they have their own favorite model which suits their needs best and defend that car above all other, of course this leads to banter and I for one think its in most cases done without malice...........it should be remembered that reading a comment on a forum can never reflect the tone of voice in which it was written.
 
Well said Darren.
It is very difficult tho, to put any car in good light, that has a bad reliability reputation among owners, ex owners and garage mechanics alike. Some of the issues about the FSI could be attributed to poor maintenance/servicing etc. As we all know the A2 FSI needs selective care, as it was the first development petrol model (in the FSI category) in the VAG range. Frustratingly i think no other engine parts from other VAG cars can be retrofitted to the A2(please correct me if i'm incorrect) I think the FSI could be the best A2 to own, If the running issues could be 'engineered out'. It's a pity these tuning companies do not offer anything for the A2 FSI model in regards the troublesome inlet manifold, thermostat etc.
Having owned similar cars in the past, My late plate Corrado G60 with ABS springs to mind, some forum members suggested removal of the troublesome ABS system. But I opted for the expense of having it repaired to keep the car original. I am not put off owning another A2 FSI by the issues surrounding the model.
Having seen your stunning A2, I sympathize with your frustration at the amount of negativity surrounding the FSI model on forums etc. I for one am not put off from the challenge of owning/maintaining a car that i want. And i think the FSI model will attract like minded Owners who will like being in a select club (i.e. limited model numbers). He who laughs last, springs to mind.
FSI numbers are dwindling, and I think now is the time to act before the damage, not just to the FSI model but to A2 numbers is irreparable.
Best of luck to all FSI owners i salute you.
Steve
 
Good call Darren

There is a saying in life which is particularly relevant here - If you have nothing positive to say then say nothing
I think the 'jibes' made at the expense of FSI owners were probably meant in fun, but just like the Club's zero bad language policy, if not checked it quickly becomes the norm and the severity starts to creep up to gain more effect. It would certainly be off putting for potential new members, or even long standing members wanting to sell their cars.

As you indicated, 'telling it how it is' is not an issue and knowing what to look for could even be a great help for new owners looking to buy a FSI. Traditionally the most powerful car in the range usually becomes the most sought after model so it should have a great future as a useable classic.

Cheers Spike
 
Agree with the majority of this discussion and well done to Darren for raising it.
Absolutely tell it like it is- however I've bit my tongue a few times when the FSI has been on the receiving end of negative commentary.
Some of it has been most unkind. And that is not A2OC.
Whether it be humourous or not in its intent - this builds a picture over time and it's not fair to owners of the variant or those seeking to buy.
As keepers and I hope protectors of classic cars we should extol the virtues of every model whilst sharing our experience and knowledge objectively and without negativity.

Depending on environmental legislation over the next couple of decades it could well be the FSI gang that get the last laugh ?
 
The way I see it is every A2 is great whatever the engine TDI or petrol

The FSI seem more problematic but every car is with age !!! ?

at the end of the day a car doesn’t just run with petrol/diesel it requires work along the way. As the saying goes nothing last forever?
 
This does beg the question of why Audi were using plastic materials that were totally unfit for purpose. It should surely be their responsibility to supply suitable replacements FOC. Anybody who has purchased a Tefal Actifry will know the problem.

RAB
 
I’m a Moulding Engineer in the plastics industry and I was thinking the other day I wish Audi made the door pockets a little bigger so I could fit more things in, but then I also thought if the door pockets were bigger then the A2 would be wider, if the plastic parts on our cars were made from other materials then the car would have been heavier or more expensive, if they wade all those changes then it would no longer be an A2.
 
RAB said:
This does beg the question of why Audi were using plastic materials that were totally unfit for purpose. It should surely be their responsibility to supply suitable replacements FOC. Anybody who has purchased a Tefal Actifry will know the problem.

RAB
Click to expand...

The death pipe was also an issue on the vr6, v6 4motion and r32 in that scene it was called the crack pipe. After market in the states you can buy and expensive aluminium version


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Agreed - each to their own in terms of TDI / FSI / 1.4.
Unfortunately what one person finds funny another will take offence over. That’s life.
 
My fsi has been an absolute joy since I bought it...more than happy to sing it's praises. I was wary when I bought it, but then again I was was wary before buying any car in the past...if you are prepared to look after any car, then the car will look after you...simple
A decent car is fun to own, no matter what brand or model...
 
Darren C said:
Evening troop,

I’d like to start by saying that I am not without a sense of humour nor am I biased toward a particular engine type in the A2, having had three variations in the family over the course of time. I’m penning this not in defence of my own A2, but broader, in the interests of those who own or aspire (yes) to own an FSI.

When I joined this wonderful club in 2005 with my TDI special edition, the family friendly atmosphere that predominantly remains today was the entirety of the club. There was no snobbery about what specification of A2 you owned, no penalty for owning a derivative other than a TDI, the ownership experience and club solidarity was centred on the car. I’ve since seen a distinct and very unsavoury swing against this club ethos.

The FSI was Audi’s first attempt at innovative fuel saving technology in a petrol engine. Yes, it is far from perfect, or reliable, the facts are the facts. I’d not advocate anything but the reality. If someone was looking for a reliable, cheap to run daily, I’d not champion the FSI personally. That said, a good running FSI is a pleasure, smooth and efficient and with good economy and reasonable power on tap too. In many respects the pioneering FSI suits the pioneering A2.

So, back to the point in hand. Presenting the facts about the FSIs many problems in a measured balanced way, as is duly exercised with the TDI 90, dual mass flywheel and variable vane turbo against the power, performance and economy, is fair and on point. To berate consistently in a manner that may make owners of such cars feel less-valued amongst the club following, falls well below the kindness that the club is renowned for. Sadly this is more of a constant on this forum now.

I fear such actions might also put off new members who have joined for advice and counsel and who are met with derogatory remarks from such a loyal following.

This thread is a plea in effect. We all share the passion that is the A2, we are all here because we love the A2 and in equal measure we all love our own cars. This applies whether a base car or a fully loaded model and/or regardless of which of the five engine choices are hidden beneath the removable bonnet.

All derivatives deserve to be cherished and all deserve to wear the A2 badge. In equal measure, all deserve our respect.

I’m asking that the club pull together here and help to make the A2 ownership and classic car status fun for all and a reality for all.

Darren
Click to expand...
WELl SAID DARREN !!!!!!!
I totally agree and even though I hardly post these days (only because I no longer own any A2s) I feel strongly enough to support your well written and justified comments.
Steve B
 
Given the specific issues with the FSI (and the fact that much of the garage trade does not like dealing with them / does not understand them) it might be time for an enterprising FSI owner on here with the mechanical skills to set up as a specialist so that owners have a trusted repair resource?
It’s been done for OSS and various other re-manufactured parts ......
 
I agree wholeheartedly with your opening statement Darren. I've perhaps been guilty of being over critical of the FSi in the past ?

Perhaps the community could write a guide for the FSi which we could then direct newer members to so instead of getting a barrage of negative opinion (containing some fact) it could be an informative piece allowing people to go into a potential purchase 'eyes open' and better understand the maintenance it requires, like 99 ron fuel for instance. Perhaps we could perform the same for the other models also.

I'm far from an expert on either model, just an idea though :)
 
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