Bluemotion MZN gearbox, an alternative...

Well, here we go again; Enjoy! ?


Double thumbs up from me - Really helpful and essential reading for anyone considering an upgraded five speed. I like how you mounted the camera / your phone on the wheel!

I think this shows off the versatility of the conversion when driving off-motorways, with acceptable motorway rpm’s in addition. I wonder if someone with a JDD could make a similar video?!
 
Hello folks ....and specifically @Menno...

I am seriously considering purchasing an MZN gearbox. Please forgive my lazy research; I've got a few precious hours as the passenger in a vehicle and have 101 little online jobs that need doing.

I'm looking at gearboxes such as this one, from 2010-ish 1.2 TDIs...

Is this gearbox suitable?
Am I missing a crucial variation that needs to be considered?
Is the bell-housing on these gearboxes of a suitable depth for a TDI with a single-mass flywheel?
Will the original starter motor be suitable?
Do the gear-shift cables require any custom bracketry to be made, as with the MYP gearbox, or does everything just bolt on as intended?
Other than the modifications required to the gearbox mountings, it is effectively a plug-n-play installation?

Many thanks. Hopefully we'll see another long-legged 5-speed TDI in operation soon. :)

Tom
 
Hello Timmus,
I recently did a gearbox upgrade, my gearbox is MAL.
Unlike MAL gearbox, MZN has an additional connector - neutral position signal, so no significant / mechanical difference.
That gearbox will fit an AMF engine with mods that you mentioned.
I reused the original starter motor, mine is Bosch.
I reused selector lever (6X0711051C) from the EWQ to clear the starter motor.
I also reused shaft flanges from the EWQ gearbox.
Gear linkage do not need customisation, bracket bolts on the same location, one additional part needed is cable end Topran 116351755.

The only problem that I had was (this may be because I used EWQ gear lever): MAL/MZN gearboxes are approx. 1 cm shorter (measured from the bellhousing to the gear cover) than EWQ, we had to cut a part of the gearbox mount 8Z0199543A so that the cable end could clear the mount when shifting into the 2nd gear.
After all the work I'm happy with the result. It takes a few miles to get used to the new gearing, but imho, it's worth it. :)
Hope this helps.

Cheers,
Neo
 
Hello Timmus,
I recently did a gearbox upgrade, my gearbox is MAL.
Unlike MAL gearbox, MZN has an additional connector - neutral position signal, so no significant / mechanical difference.
That gearbox will fit an AMF engine with mods that you mentioned.
I reused the original starter motor, mine is Bosch.
I reused selector lever (6X0711051C) from the EWQ to clear the starter motor.
I also reused shaft flanges from the EWQ gearbox.
Gear linkage do not need customisation, bracket bolts on the same location, one additional part needed is cable end Topran 116351755.

The only problem that I had was (this may be because I used EWQ gear lever): MAL/MZN gearboxes are approx. 1 cm shorter (measured from the bellhousing to the gear cover) than EWQ, we had to cut a part of the gearbox mount 8Z0199543A so that the cable end could clear the mount when shifting into the 2nd gear.
After all the work I'm happy with the result. It takes a few miles to get used to the new gearing, but imho, it's worth it. :)
Hope this helps.

Cheers,
Neo
That’s excellent, Neo. Thank you for taking the time to reply in such detail; much appreciated.

Kind regards,

Tom
 
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@timmus the post of @neo is correct and spot on, although in my case there was no cable mod required with the EWQ lever installed.
Also the dogbone will be connected to the "new" gearbox with only 2ea bolts instead of 3ea, although it's possible to make a bracket for it if you can't sleep about it.

One thing to keep in mind is to alter the casing (at approx orange arrows, please take exact measurements and/or copy from your original gearbox) ) if you decide to remove sump at a later stage (change oil pump chain as an example).
Screenshot_20210922_194021.jpg


Original gearbox has cut outs on the lower casing, most JDD, MZN, MAL and also 6 speeders do not have those.
Gearbox will fit without making the cutouts, but will give you (or your garage/mechanic....) a challenge if the sump has to come off!

See also the 6 speeder thread, post #270:
 
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A am also considering installation of a different type of gearbox when mine will end (and I think it will be soon) but what bothers me is the difference between MZN, MAL, MNY, MZK - as I see that MZN is the most expensive and MZK being the cheapest...
 
I bought a MZN from VAG breakers at Leeds, my friend picked it up for me but when it arrived the shift tower had been removed despite being in the pictures. Seller assured me he had the shift tower from that box on the shelf and could post it to me (sounds fishy) it arrived and wouldn't fit, my guess it was from an 02J but these boxes are 02R. Had to return box myself at my own expense for their mistake not happy!
Shame as I had already bought the driveshaft seals required for swapping over the drive shaft flanges from current box.
I have a JDD was going to save that for Mr Black as that's a five seater, will stick it in Mr Silver instead. JDD requires nothing over than casing cutting and spacers for the upper bolts will then use Mr Silvers old box parts to get a MZN ready for install into Mr Black
 
T
I bought a MZN from VAG breakers at Leeds, my friend picked it up for me but when it arrived the shift tower had been removed despite being in the pictures. Seller assured me he had the shift tower from that box on the shelf and could post it to me (sounds fishy) it arrived and wouldn't fit, my guess it was from an 02J but these boxes are 02R. Had to return box myself at my own expense for their mistake not happy!
Shame as I had already bought the driveshaft seals required for swapping over the drive shaft flanges from current box.
I have a JDD was going to save that for Mr Black as that's a five seater, will stick it in Mr Silver instead. JDD requires nothing over than casing cutting and spacers for the upper bolts will then use Mr Silvers old box parts to get a MZN ready for install into Mr Black
That sounds bad …
Will the original tower fit the MZN gearbox ?
 
T

That sounds bad …
Will the original tower fit the MZN gearbox ?
Sorry I should have explained, basically don't buy a gearbox without the tower, I didn't but that's what I got sent so tried the incorrect one they sent and I could not get it in and even asked a colleague who's spent 25 years in VW workshops and he could not either!
The box in Mr Silver is a EWR which according to the casing is a 02R so potentially I Could have swapped that over but didn't want to be in an awkward situation if not!
 
Are the gearbox flanges different on the MZN, MAL MNY ect as the JDD is also an 02R gearbox yet folk have said they have been able to simply bolt the driveshaft straight to them with no need to swap from existing box or is my info incorrect?
 
Are the gearbox flanges different on the MZN, MAL MNY ect as the JDD is also an 02R gearbox yet folk have said they have been able to simply bolt the driveshaft straight to them with no need to swap from existing box or is my info incorrect?
To answer my own question yes, seems their is a "dry" and a "wet" drive cup flange (ohh boy!!) should have simply studied the pictures of the various box's!!
I want my box to ready for install prior to starting the job hence the question
Edit
Some JDD boxes have the wet flanges so anyone converting pay attention to the driveshaft flanges!
 
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No not got around to it yet but it's primed and ready to go in the sense that it's got the correct drive flanges, web cut and spacers added
Perfect maybe you could post a photo of the cut out work and spacers please on coming weeks? 🙏
 
If your replacing the mounting at the same time and therefore have a new mounting you can remove the minimum amount of material required to get the mount to clear

I got the spacers from @depronman they are very sexy! I am very anal about all fixings really, I asked him to make me some M10 6.5mm thick as per a previous post, however I have found with this new mount (non genuine) that the ideal spacing is actually 7.5mm

Some people have commented that the gear change has fouled the mounting, my assumption is that those folk haven't spaced the mounting off correctly

Will try and grab some pics when I can
 
If your replacing the mounting at the same time and therefore have a new mounting you can remove the minimum amount of material required to get the mount to clear

I got the spacers from @depronman they are very sexy! I am very anal about all fixings really, I asked him to make me some M10 6.5mm thick as per a previous post, however I have found with this new mount (non genuine) that the ideal spacing is actually 7.5mm

Some people have commented that the gear change has fouled the mounting, my assumption is that those folk haven't spaced the mounting off correctly

Will try and grab some pics when I can

I can make you some thicker spacers if you like


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
If your replacing the mounting at the same time and therefore have a new mounting you can remove the minimum amount of material required to get the mount to clear

I got the spacers from @depronman they are very sexy! I am very anal about all fixings really, I asked him to make me some M10 6.5mm thick as per a previous post, however I have found with this new mount (non genuine) that the ideal spacing is actually 7.5mm

Some people have commented that the gear change has fouled the mounting, my assumption is that those folk haven't spaced the mounting off correctly

Will try and grab some pics when I can
Do you mean this bit pictured? You fitted this to box already with spacers?
Screenshot_20231102_220631_eBay.jpg
 
I can make you some thicker spacers if you like


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Thanks Paul that's very kind!

Should I need more I will go for the larger ones, I fitted the 6.5 mm ones with Mr Silvers jdd box and they worked a treat was only when I was prepping Mr blacks mzn that I noticed I slight tolerance so I bought some 0.5mm m10 shims to see what I was dealing with and found by adding 2 to the rear most mount hole on the inside it removed this tolerance nicely so will glue these onto the new mount!
I simply wanted to inform folk of the best solution, I hope it didn't come across as any form of criticism in any way, shape or form especially as you did precisely what I asked and I mean precisely, blooming marvellous!!
 
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