Getting my retaliation in first

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kit lewis

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As you will see from my 'signature' below I'm supposed to take delivery of my new pride and joy in December 2002. Having been lurking and taking part in the forum for a while now I've read about all sorts of horror stories and common faults on the A2.

Thought I would put these down in a letter to my local dealer to establish some ground rules prior to delivery and get them on the ball early (OK - but I live in hope!)

Points were as follows and I quote:

1. Headlamp condensation. It appears that the front lights in some A2’s collect condensation/water and that these have to be replaced in time. This is a known fault and I hope that by now this is a thing of the past.

2. 2003 Model A2’s. There appears to be an overlap with 2002 and the 2003 models so that some 03 cars are being delivered with 02 features, specifically the old style windscreen wiper and smaller fuel tank. We expect that our car will come with all the 2003 features as advertised.

4.Poor Stereo Reception. It is widely reported that radio reception on the A2 is poor, especially on AM. As I listen a great deal to AM radio as I travel, this is a major concern to me. Please can you confirm if the AM reception is as poor as reported? If this is the case, then what can be done to improve the situation?

5. Build quality – Squeaks & Rattles. There seem to have been many problems with squeaking seats and trim. Unfortunately this appears to be a common experience for most A2OC members and often requires several trips back to the dealer to sort out. I trust your PDI process will pick up and fix any such problems.

6. FSI Engine vibrations. There have been several people who have complained of a knocking vibration on FSI engines, which comes through the clutch pedal. I already know the engine is supposed to be noisier than the 1.4 – that’s not the concern at this stage. Once again – one for your PDI department

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Have I missed anything? Once again many thanks to the rest of you who have raised these points over the last few months. Knowlege is power and I hope to have these problems sorted out come delivery. After all - they have had notice!

Take Care

Kit

Soon to be the owner of a Dolphin Grey 1.6 FSI SE with Red Leather, ECC, DIS & Symphony 6 CD
 
Don't forget to tell em to make sure alll packaging is off, its common that some A2's come with the suspension packing still on and causes knocking noises, tell em to make sure its all off.

Bear in mind all these faults you have listed and the one I have just listen are common or fairly common faults, dont forget theres tons mroe that can arrise which are not common, e.g. my anti roll bar at the front had broken links causing a very unpleasent sound and bouce whenever I went over a speed bump or pot hole, and as far as I can tell mine is the only one it has happened to, so dont limit your faults to just those, ask the dealer to test drive the car before giving it to you to make sure no unsuaul noises or execessive bouncing occurs, if possible go along for the test drive so you can identify any faults that the dealer may have inadvertedly missed;);).

Audi A2 1.4SE 2001, Brilliant Silver, Rear electric windows and Panasonic MR555 (rubbish) stereo, 2 extra 13" 190watt speakers (plus the standard 8 from audi).
 
Kit,

Factor has given me another idea. Why not say to your dealer that you wish to be present at the PDI process in order that you can be 100% happy that a good job was done.

Regards
John Disdale
 
Hmm, I'm not sure about this approach. I think giving the dealer a list of possible faults before you've even seen your car might not be considered reasonable behaviour by them, and might prejudice their treatment of you.

If I were you I'd keep the list of common faults private, and use it as a list of things to check very carefully. Take your time over the handover and check each item. Make clear to the dealer that you are going for a _test_ drive of the vehicle and you have not accepted it until you get back from said drive. If any faults exist (I hope they don't), that is the time to point them out and get them rectified, not signing for the car until all remedial work has been done.

Just my 2p. I hope you enjoy the car and that it is perfect. FWIW I got a brand new 1.4 petrol as a courtesy car at the weekend and couldn't detect any rattles. Seemed better built than my TT...

viffer
 
Perhaps an Audi dealer might actually regard a paying customer to be a total inconvenience to their operations, and so I can see that anyone trying to look after their own interests might be considered to be acting unreasonably. My only problem with such a statement is that we are talking about car salesmen here not the Royal Family, or the Pope. Heavens above my dealer never cared a stuff about behaving in a reasonable or responsible manner, and not for one second will I ever believe they were unique in this area.

What I say is this. If a dealer is going to have a tantrum over a customer trying to protect their interests, then ascertain this in the early stages, and if it’s the case don’t hand over any money, but go somewhere else instead.

For sure I can think of a reason why a dealer would not wish a customer present during a PDI check, but the only real reason would likely be that the dealer would not wish it known that such an exercise was carried out rapidly and in a complacent manner. I ask you – who the heck has a job/profession where its taboo to allow the client to witness what one does in order to take their money ? (Of course this question does not apply to politicians, or Government bureaucrats).

Regards
John Disdale
 
Yup - a test drive before I hand over my hard earned cash is going to be top of the agenda. It's all your fault by the way - I was completely ignorant until one day I stumbled upon a little forum of A2 Owners ..... Cheers!

Take Care

Kit

Soon to be the owner of a Dolphin Grey 1.6 FSI SE with Red Leather, ECC, DIS & Symphony 6 CD
 
Mr Disdale,

It wasn't the presence at the PDI that I thought could be construed as unreasonable / neurotic. Indeed I agree with you that this is a good idea and I'd be dismayed if a dealer rejected it. The thing I do think might turn out to be detrimental to kit's own interests is the sending of a list of faults before he's even seen the car. Although an open minded dealer might take it as a worthwhile contribution to the process I fear that, whatever your view of Audi dealers, it might not work out well for our soon-to-be-A2-owning boardmate.

Let me explain.

If you believe that Audi dealers are competent and wonderful human beings, there's no need to send them the potential faults list and you are mildly insulting their professional competence (and not giving them a chance to hand over what might be a fault-free car) by doing so. No real harm done though, since they won't mind. There will be a nice group hug and it will all be forgotten.

If, however, you believe that Audi dealers are incompetent money-grabbing charlatans who care not a jot for your custom, you have to entertain the possiblity that faced with a "smart-a**e" with a list of problems they have downloaded from the internet, they'll just laugh and treat you worse than would otherwise have been the case. Based on this assumption, I think your best bet is to take it gently, be polite, and restrict your complaints to proven faults not assumed ones. I think it weakens your position to show them the potential faults list - just gives them an excuse to not take you seriously.

Of course, this is all IMHO.

Best regards,
viffer
 
By the way, you should hear what doctors (from the arrogant end of the spectrum) say about patients who come in with reams of stuff they've downloaded from the internet... if you are such a patient, I strongly advise you to know it all but pretend you don't.

viffer
 
Viffer - loads of patients are doing just that - as someone who has been dealt with by the MOD as a possible Gulf War Syndrome patient I can tell you that I am a great fan of patient/consumer knowledge! I was drawn to this forum to learn all I could about the A2 - warts and all - and I've already had this conversation with the dealer about possible problems with this fine car. He knows that I mean no harm - but just want him and the company to be on the ball. If he is then it's the start of a wonderful relationship... If not then you'll all get to hear about it.
Was the letter rude - possibly. Was it sharp - definately. I am one of the empowered generation!

Take Care

Kit

Soon to be the owner of a Dolphin Grey 1.6 FSI SE with Red Leather, ECC, DIS & Symphony 6 CD
 
I agree with Viffer 100%.

Most A2 owners do not have all the faults mentioned, some people have no faults on their cars, some people have different faults. Some people have faults in their cars but don't know it, or even have faults themselves and don't know it...

Chivers ':)'
'02 A2 1.4TDi SE
 
Viffer,

Your opinion has no greater nor no lesser value than my own, but you presume far too much in reckoning that I might believe Audi dealers are competent and wonderful human beings. To me there is nothing wonderful in being stabbed in the back, and I expect there are others on this forum who would feel absolutely lost in equating the word professionalism with the level of service which they have received from their dealer.

I remain adamant, and indeed repetitive in my claim that it is hardly a sin to try and protect ones investment, and I see Kit as wishing to do no more than this. Just one look at his use of the English language clearly portrays that his style for doing so is highly unlikely to involve arrogance, rudeness, or an outright threat. Indeed if he projects any illusion to the dealer I hope the message conveyed is of an A2 owner who has a keen interest in the model, and is not about to be a push over for potential poor standards. Obviously I do concede that car dealers regard and refer to customers as “punters” – but hopefully that is not to presume that we are all blunt at both ends.

Btw, are you associated in any way with a car manufacturer/dealer ?

Just talking about Doctor’s (and their integrity) has brought a smile to my face, when a few days ago one of our local GP’s hit the headlines in being caught fiddling hundreds of thousands of pounds from the NHS. He apparently owns 24 different properties (including an Indian Restaurant), but hey I guess it should have been 25 if he had worked a little harder and really knew his stuff as a professional.

Regards
John Disdale
 
John Disdale - No, I am in no way connected with any car manufacturer or dealer, except as a customer. Knowing your (well-founded) opinion of such organisations, I'll try not to take offence at the question :)

Kit - I'm glad your dealer was responsive to your pre-emptive strike. And I hope your A2 is perfect. Enjoy. And on a serious subject I hope you don't think I was condoning the arrogance of those doctors who dislike patient power. I agree with you 100% re its positive benefits and I see this kind of information sharing as one of the many great things about the internet. My only point (analagous to my point about Audi dealers) is that if you do get an arrogant one, a softly-softly approach (being careful not to confront until it is necessary) might yield the best outcome for you. Just my experience, which (to echo JD's words) is no more or less valid than anyone else's.

viffer
 
Viffer - my thoughts exactly. It's horses for courses and I just wanted to let my dealer know that I know...if you see what I mean.

Take Care

Kit

Soon to be the owner of a Dolphin Grey 1.6 FSI SE with Red Leather, ECC, DIS & Symphony 6 CD
 
factor-you ain't kidding on the suspension packing-I take it you read my previous problems on this subject?. The fact the PDI sheet was ticked of meant didily-squat.

Just to stir the hornets nest again-and you can kick me in the shins at the social (if I ever make it!. If you go to view a second hand car-even nearly new-would you not look into any known problems this make of vehicle suffers and check this particualr car didn't?. I suppose you could level the same at a new car. It is ashame as you shouldn't have to, but if Audi are producing vehicle with inherrent problems then it's only natural you want to be on the look out.

Oh well, good luck whatever happens!.

Steve - 2003 1.4SE petrol, Silver, black/black interior
 
LMAO they sold me my s/h car suposedly fault free with just a respray of the bonnet scheduled for the next time I went there, when I went there and told them of fault i found they done some mroe checks possible a real PDI check, not the rubbish the dealer gave me (he gave me the checklist sheet) and they found I had practically no brakes (95% worn.)

1.4SE petrol 2001, Dark interior, Sat cloth, Brilliant Silver, 3 spoke Steering wheel, Rear electric windows and Panasonic MR555 (maybe not so rubbish afterall) stereo, 2 extra 13" 190watt speakers (plus the standard 8 from audi). <==== just Subsidising till I get my TVR Tuscan S.
 
Viffer,

I am aware that I come over strong at times, but to be totally honest if you had been related to the car industry I would not have thought any worse of you at all. The only reason that I asked the question was because it appeared to me that you were trying hard to defend the “poor old dealer” – and I was trying to understand why.

In case you had not read one of Kit’s previous related topics it was his dream to collect his new car from the factory in Germany (before ascertaining he might need to go to Hungary). I would have therefore hoped that his dealer would have recognised and appreciated such levels of enthusiasm, and not regarded this (or any other enthusiastic request) as being a threat to anything. Indeed I would argue that any business that regards customer/client involvement as a form of threat will likely be a highly inferior company, and one best avoided. The only sad thing there is that sometimes we only find out about such attitudes when it’s far too late.

I can recall several instances (from the forum) where dealers/mechanics have greatly involved A2 owners by fully explaining what’s what. This for me is the correct, just, and sociable path, but as I say I am talking of several instances, whereas I should be able to recall countless hundreds. Of course the reason that I cannot do so is all down to dealer attitude, and as I have insinuated before just because one has a “job” it hardly makes them into professionals. That said when a dealer carries out any work to an Audi one can be assured of a top class professional invoice – yet the standard of service often received lacks any remote sign of high standards.

My level of argument/social banter is not saying that all Audi dealers or employees are totally hopeless, but at the same time I am not about to accept that the “axis of evil” is the customer come A2 owner.

Being that we are nagging about PDI’s I still think the funniest of stories was the check list which had received a “tick” for checking the air pressure in the spare wheel was correct – when the car didn’t have a spare wheel.

Regards
John Disdale
 
John - I shall be looking out for the spare tyre tick now you mention it!

Take Care

Kit

Soon to be the owner of a Dolphin Grey 1.6 FSI SE with Red Leather, ECC, DIS & Symphony 6 CD
 
The Dealer Strikes Back</u>

You might be interested in knowing the results of my letter to the dealer discussed above..........

Had a charming and grown up discussion earlier on today about the contents of my letter.

1. Headlamps - they do condense as they are made of plastic and the seals can leak occasionally (don't point a jet wash at them..) It apparently takes a while for the seals to bed in, and most are now perfectly fine, but any serious leaks will be replaced under warranty.

2. AM Radio - it's a known problem but not one that a German company with that country's lack of AM takes particularly seriously. Unfortunately as an aluminium car it's a real problem as alloy doesn't conduct as well as a steel car - hence problems with an aftermarket solution. Sorry but no Audi solution at present.

3. Squeaks & Rattles - current A2 FSI's are quiet and don't have a problem with rattles and squeaks.

4. FSI engines - it's new technology and it's a completely new design so it won't sound, vibrate or perform like anything else on the road. Audi just won a prize for innovation with the FSI engine so that's OK then!

5. All FSI's are of the 2003 variety - in fact it's the FSI that marks the change from 2002 to 2003 model year.

I'm still not happy about the AM reception - but won't be able to quantify this until I get into it and try it. I'm also still dubious about the squeaks etc as there are so many of you out there with a different story - but for now that's enough and all I wanted to hear.

Contrary to expectations of some of the group the dealer was happy to discuss these problems and was very open and helpful. At the very least we understand each other and what we expect of each other!

The car is rapidly approaching completion and should be with us in early December - can't wait.

Take care :)

Kit

Soon to be the owner of a Dolphin Grey 1.6 FSI SE with Red Leather, ECC, DIS & Symphony 6 CD
 
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