TDi 75 AMF coolant leak from hoses tandem vacuum/fuel pump seals?

philward

A2OC Donor
I want to know if the fuel bulb works, if it does I will get one.
Otherwise you could connect a fully charged battery and turn the key. Don’t crank it too long let it cool and crank again. Started every time for me that way. I guess the pump is self priming?
 

froggy

Member
I want to know if the fuel bulb works, if it does I will get one.
Otherwise you could connect a fully charged battery and turn the key. Don’t crank it too long let it cool and crank again. Started every time for me that way. I guess the pump is self priming?
Yes the pump is definitely self priming. I ran out of fuel years ago, if memory serves it was my first ever post on here and I found a thread by @Skipton01 that helped me get started again. That was with an excellent battery though so I want to give this one every chance. I’ve got it connected to an automatic charger in a recovery mode. It’s only 4A so will take a while. I got a spark of the negative post when connecting the leads which means there’s life in it yet. Currently hovering between 12.7-12.9 v and was 12.4 I think when I connected it about an hour ago.
 

philward

A2OC Donor
Yes the pump is definitely self priming. I ran out of fuel years ago, if memory serves it was my first ever post on here and I found a thread by @Skipton01 that helped me get started again. That was with an excellent battery though so I want to give this one every chance. I’ve got it connected to an automatic charger in a recovery mode. It’s only 4A so will take a while. I got a spark of the negative post when connecting the leads which means there’s life in it yet. Currently hovering between 12.7-12.9 v and was 12.4 I think when I connected it about an hour ago.
Any bad battery can make 13v, the test is does it maintain it when / after cranking. If the battery dies quickly you probably need a new one.

Edit, do you have a second car? Get it running and jump it across. Reasonably confident that's what I did the last but one time I started the A2 with a new tandem pump.
 

froggy

Member
Any bad battery can make 13v, the test is does it maintain it when / after cranking. If the battery dies quickly you probably need a new one.

Edit, do you have a second car? Get it running and jump it across. Reasonably confident that's what I did the last but one time I started the A2 with a new tandem pump.
I never considered that - I do but its only an old 1.3 petrol. Would it be strong enough to jump a 1.4 diesel that needs a lot of cranking 🤔
 

philward

A2OC Donor
I never considered that - I do but its only an old 1.3 petrol. Would it be strong enough to jump a 1.4 diesel that needs a lot of cranking 🤔
Good question, may be pushing things a bit. If they were my cars I would try but keep a close eye on cables and connections for excessive heat.
If you do go this way start with fully charged batteries and keep the car being jumped from running.
 

froggy

Member
Ok so fuel was sucked through the tandem and following @audifan advice, on the second set of 10 second cranks, she fired up!! I gave it some gas worried that it would conk out but after about 7-8 seconds I could feel the revs pushing back against me and dropping so i let it go. No signs of leaking or other issues - does anyone have any advice on wether I should keep trying, or maybe the fuel filter is clogged up?
 

audifan

A2OC Donor
Try again. All the fuel lines are now air tight? The bulb pump has been removed from the return line? Just use short crank times. If the filter was clogged that badly it would never have fired up. Could still require a filter change but lets get it running.
 

froggy

Member
Some more photos now to show the final stages of the process. First job was to suck fuel through the tandem. A split bin bag and and kitchen towel was spread under the tandem to catch spillages. The fuel return was disconnected at the tandem and clear tubing attached to a fuel bulb. The arrow was set the correct way this time thanks to Graham, pointing away from the tandem and the other end connected to the return hose marked blue from the fuel rail. I had a bit of difficulty again removing the hose from the tandem. The tool pictured did help a bit, but you need a gap between the hose and metal pipe to insert it. I had some difficulty using the fuel bulb. It just kept going flat so it could not be pumped repeatedly. I disconnected the clear tubing to get air into the fuel bulb to squeeze again, but it just stayed flat. Finally I pulled the fuel hose end off and re-inserted the fuel bulb, but did not push it fully home. This time I could get a few more squeezes in before it flattened and happily some fuel came through. The bulb was disconnected and the pipes refitted. The return to the tandem was perished and narrowed at the end and during re-fitting the original clip came off. For security I fitted a new jubilee clip but I do think possibly the hose need replacing.

Battery fully charged and re-installed, big crackle and small spark scared the wits out of me (I hate connecting batteries up) but clocks all back on and key synced again. Not sure what the little coiled plastic wire is near the positive cable. Now Graham’s cranking sequence was followed and on the very last turn of the second 10 second crank the engine fired into life. Unfortunately it only ran for a few seconds maybe 10 but no more.
 

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froggy

Member
Try again. All the fuel lines are now air tight? The bulb pump has been removed from the return line? Just use short crank times. If the filter was clogged that badly it would never have fired up. Could still require a filter change but lets get it running.
Thank you for that, the fuel bulb was removed and all fuel lines seem fine. I’ve run out of time tonight and worried about killing the battery again. I will try again after work tomorrow. The fact that the revs dropped even with the accelerator pressed must mean fuel starvation I guess? I got the mrs to watch the suspect blue return hose for leaks and she saw nothing while it was running and no traces on the kitchen towel either.
 
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philward

A2OC Donor
Little coiled plastic wire is an expansion overflow for the battery. It plugs in at the top of the battery, the hole most likely has a stopper in it.
 

audifan

A2OC Donor
The bulb going flat is actually showing that all connections are tight and you are creating the vacuum required to pull the fuel into the tandem. As the fuel comes through it will expand the bulb but does take several tries to suck the fuel all the way from the tank. I described the bulb method as it is the cheapest home method. I now use a hand vacuum pump but again it is not an instant process to get the fuel where it is wanted.

Nice clear pictures of the progress and turning into a good how to article.

BTW those exposed terminals to the left of the positive terminal should be inside a plastic case to prevent short circuiting the battery. They have been known to become loose over time causing electrical issues. Make sure they are all tight before you suitably insulate them if you do not currently ( no pun intended ) have the correct case for them.
 

froggy

Member
The bulb going flat is actually showing that all connections are tight and you are creating the vacuum required to pull the fuel into the tandem. As the fuel comes through it will expand the bulb but does take several tries to suck the fuel all the way from the tank. I described the bulb method as it is the cheapest home method. I now use a hand vacuum pump but again it is not an instant process to get the fuel where it is wanted.

Nice clear pictures of the progress and turning into a good how to article.

BTW those exposed terminals to the left of the positive terminal should be inside a plastic case to prevent short circuiting the battery. They have been known to become loose over time causing electrical issues. Make sure they are all tight before you suitably insulate them if you do not currently ( no pun intended ) have the correct case for them.
Oh no @audifan you are going all @Birchall on us! Good to know that the system is tight - each time I disconnected the fuel bulb a little air rushed out and I did think maybe that was a good sign. I gave up too soon on it, thinking as long as fuel has pulled through the tandem then that was it, but perhaps I should have kept going until it made it fully back to the fuel rail.

I did find a flat plastic cover in the battery well and had no idea what is was for, I shall fit this tomorrow.

Although the car started briefly today I know I am not quite there yet, but I want to say again how grateful I am to everyone who helped, but to you in particular - this car would probably be at a breakers by now if it wasn’t for you 👍
 
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philward

A2OC Donor
I just connect everything and turn the key. It cranks a while, it clatters a bit then it goes. Done it that way, I think, three times now.
 

froggy

Member
I just connect everything and turn the key. It cranks a while, it clatters a bit then it goes. Done it that way, I think, three times now.
I remember when I ran out of fuel cranking for a long time to start it, but worried about killing the battery. Can you remember roughly how long you continuously cranked for to get yours started? When mine did run it was quite clattery, but if it lasting longer I think it might settle.
 

2work

Admin Team
I remember when I ran out of fuel cranking for a long time to start it, but worried about killing the battery. Can you remember roughly how long you continuously cranked for to get yours started? When mine did run it was quite clattery, but if it lasting longer I think it might settle.

Rob,

It looks like Graham gave you a very good procedure to follow in Post #152.

So are all the fuel hoses now reconnected or do you still have the bulb on the return line? If the bulb is still on use that, but if everything now reconnected then leave like this and carefully use the starter / battery to suck the fuel up. To not overwork the starter or battery do this. Crank for 5 seconds and turn off, let sit for 20 seconds. Crank for 7 seconds turn off and let sit for 30 seconds. Crank for 10 seconds and if it does not fire leave for 2 minutes. Crank for 10 seconds and if it still does not fire leave for 5 minutes. Start again from the beginning i.e. the 5 / 20, 7 /30 etc.
If it has not at least coughed by now recheck the fuel supply and return hoses are indeed connected to their correct ports on the tandem pump.

Once running check for firstly any fuel leaks then water leaks and lastly oil leaks. If all good remove any protection in the engine bay and let the engine idle for 15 minutes and quickly recked for leaks. If the expansion tank cap is still off refit it and drive the car around the block then turn off the engine and walk away. Come back 15 minutes later and check for leaks, check the coolant level and top up if needed and check the oil level. Make sure anything that was intentionally or accidentally moved is now back where it should be and secure.

Over the next few trips recheck the coolant and oil levels and for leaks. Once you are confident all OK mark the tick on the jobs done list.
Kind regards,

Tom
 

audifan

A2OC Donor
Once it has coughed the fuel is very nearly there so less cranking now needed. The issue is the air in the tandem and injector feed. This is very compressable and the injectors need pure fuel to work correctly. So until reliable pressurised diesel is in the injectors the engine will either not run, cough, run on perhaps one cylinder or make louder noises. Add in the injectors are now used you can see some may fire up quicker than others.
 

philward

A2OC Donor
I remember when I ran out of fuel cranking for a long time to start it, but worried about killing the battery. Can you remember roughly how long you continuously cranked for to get yours started? When mine did run it was quite clattery, but if it lasting longer I think it might settle.
I think the fuel bulb has done a job. I’ll look at getting one next time I need to do this job.
I would hope very little cranking is required now. If cranking kills the battery then you will probably need a new one this winter. Best know about it now.
 

froggy

Member
Had another go today, she started on the first 10 second crank, I could feel and hear a change in the cranking note, gave it some gas and she fired up. However, same thing again, sounded great for a few seconds (should I be keeping the revs up at this point?) and then the revs dropped and engine died. Is it worth putting the cap on the expansion tank until she is running?

While it was running, there was some slight smoke from the engine bay, possibly just fluids from the repair work? No sign of any leaks. On the next crank (I am turning the ignition off in between each crank) the oil pressure light came on along with some beeps. I turned everything off and got some oil. On the next attempt the oil pressure light did not come on. I finished the cranking procedure with no further luck on starting and the oil pressure light came back on again.

I’ve left it for now, hoping for some more advice if possible - should i keep going? Battery seems fine.
 

philward

A2OC Donor
No don't keep going, you have exhausted my experience now. Wait for advice from somebody more knowledgeable. I would be worried about:
Smoke with no heat.
Oil light coming on
Car not idling once it has started.
Never had any of these issues but somebody will know the answers. You need to wait.
 
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