Vrs hubs vs tdi std hubs
- Thread starter CrispyEdd
- Start date
DaveySprocket
A2OC Donor
I bought some bits of a chap recently who had done this mod on his TDi..
dj_efk
A2OC Donor
That's interesting. I should really start looking out for a set of these as really even when on top form AND considering I have uprated grooved discs and matching pads, I find the brakes on my A2 have to be really stamped on to trigger the ABS - I would prefer a touch more "bite". What model / shape of Fabia VRS should I be looking at for them?
CrispyEdd
Member
I bought these ones from autodoc, and the got the brake discs carriers, caliper and pads from a forum member off market place irrc. Was a while ago!
Hey, check out RIDEX Steering knuckle in the AUTODOC app https://m.autodoc.co.uk/ridex/13633967
Believe its fabia 6y2 vrs tdi circa 2004-2006.
Hey, check out RIDEX Steering knuckle in the AUTODOC app https://m.autodoc.co.uk/ridex/13633967
Believe its fabia 6y2 vrs tdi circa 2004-2006.
I've done this from brand new parts for the 310mm brake set up on my first Tdi, and have the same parts set accumulated for a 312mm set up on my second - I couldn't find any second hand hubs at the time, and those that appeared occasionally looked a lot tattier than they probably were.
This was all described in my "Of Brakes and Men" project thread - there was some debate regarding the weight of 310/2 discs versus 288, but I've never found this to be an issue.
At the moment with the standard 256mm set up on one and 310 on the other, the 310 you do notice a meatier pedal feel in the latter - it was initially a bit dead feeling compared to the original brakes when first fitted, but then my other half drove it for a few days, and gave the pedals a rather heavier work out than I do - and when I got it back, the feel was transformed. In fact the main thing was that it felt just like those in my then A6 which were 312mm - when you need to decelerate from motorway speeds in a hurry (ie when seeing a traffic jam forming quickly ahead) it is noticeably more effective getting down to the speed you need to be at without excessive pedal application.
A worthwhile addition in my mind.
This was all described in my "Of Brakes and Men" project thread - there was some debate regarding the weight of 310/2 discs versus 288, but I've never found this to be an issue.
At the moment with the standard 256mm set up on one and 310 on the other, the 310 you do notice a meatier pedal feel in the latter - it was initially a bit dead feeling compared to the original brakes when first fitted, but then my other half drove it for a few days, and gave the pedals a rather heavier work out than I do - and when I got it back, the feel was transformed. In fact the main thing was that it felt just like those in my then A6 which were 312mm - when you need to decelerate from motorway speeds in a hurry (ie when seeing a traffic jam forming quickly ahead) it is noticeably more effective getting down to the speed you need to be at without excessive pedal application.
A worthwhile addition in my mind.
Also worthwhile getting @George Hogg to describe his Wilwood setup - I was unable to find the caliper model on their website but I assume most of the other parts needed are the same as for any other 288mm setup? - ie were those also fitted on Vrs / Polo GTI hubs, and what other parts were needed to make them fit?
Alternatives from the VW group if you can find them are the AP racing ones used on the Ibiza Cupra around 2002-2010 with 312mm 5x100 discs - the calipers appear to fit onto the VRs/Polo GTI hubs, but have a double piston set up. They have either a 6J0 or 6LL part number.
see -
catalog.polo.blue
Unclear though if these might also need a bigger servo. The calipers on mine (Audi S1 - effectively same as MkI Audi TT or heavier A3 models in the same era with 312mm discs) work fine with the A2 original but are obviously single piston.
Alternatives from the VW group if you can find them are the AP racing ones used on the Ibiza Cupra around 2002-2010 with 312mm 5x100 discs - the calipers appear to fit onto the VRs/Polo GTI hubs, but have a double piston set up. They have either a 6J0 or 6LL part number.
see -
Brake caliper housing with pads 6J0615106
Brake caliper housing with pads AP Racing ✓ Find the right parts and accessories for your Polo 6R all in one place ➤ Discover now!
Unclear though if these might also need a bigger servo. The calipers on mine (Audi S1 - effectively same as MkI Audi TT or heavier A3 models in the same era with 312mm discs) work fine with the A2 original but are obviously single piston.
dj_efk
A2OC Donor
Steve I remember you've done this conversion before- is there somewhere on the forum a part number list for the 288mm conversion, do you know? I'd like to upgrade but keep my pepperpots in line with @CrispyEdd 's observation that this would be possible.
CrispyEdd
Member
@Bigfeet has pepperpots with this set up, I actually fit a pepperot over them iirc to prove it.
www.darksidedevelopments.co.uk
NEW SKODA FABIA MK1 / MK2 FRONT PASSENGER SIDE HUB STEERING KNUCKLE - 288MM DISC | eBay
SKODA FABIA MK1 6Y (HATCHBACK) MODELS FROM 1999-2007. - SKODA FABIA MK2 (HATCHBACK & ESTATE) MODELS FROM 2008-2014. IMPORTANT - THIS IS TO SUIT MODELS WITH 288MM FRONT DISC BRAKES WITHOUT THE BUILT IN BRAKE CARRIER (SEE PICS) .
www.ebay.co.uk
2x Brake Discs Pair Vented fits SKODA FABIA Front 99 to 22 288mm Set 1J0615301C | eBay
SKODA FABIA III Estate (NJ5) 1.0 TSI Estate Petrol 08/2014 12/2022 FWD 12 110 81. SKODA FABIA III Estate (NJ5) 1.4 TDI Estate Diesel 10/2014 12/2022 FWD 12 105 77. SKODA FABIA III Praktik (NJ5) 1.4 TDI Estate Van Diesel 10/2014 12/2022 FWD 12 105 77.
www.ebay.co.uk
Brembo HP2000 Front Brake Pads for Ibiza / Fabia / Polo 288mm Discs
Brembo Sport HP2000 Replacement Front Brake Pad Set for Ibiza / Polo / Fabia Platform with 288mm Front Discs
www.darksidedevelopments.co.uk
This is the parts list for 310/312. For 288 you use a smaller brake caliper mount on the same hub and then suitable caliper.
Of brakes and men.
Last MOT it was noted that one of my Bilstein B4 front shocks was showing some minor seepage (it's done 20-odd thousand miles in a couple of years and there are some ropey roads around here so I'm not entirely surprised). They also commented that the front pads (Pagid) fitted at the same time...
www.a2oc.net
For reference, 310/312 in this setup fits under standard 16" SE rims.
mount / caliper details for 288 are here :
Floating caliper brakeBrake caliper housingbrake c... Fabia (FAB) 2006 year skoda EUROPA 615026
Floating caliper brakeBrake caliper housingbrake carrier with<br>pad retaining pinBrake disc (vented) front<br> LUCAS 288X25MM Fabia (FAB) 2006 year skoda EUROPA 615026 spare parts
although these are a rather lurid green / red ; silver and red will be on the Polo versions linked below.
Floating caliper brakeBrake caliper housingbrake c... Polo/Derby/Vento-IND (PO) 2008 year volkswagen EUROPA 615025
Floating caliper brakeBrake caliper housingbrake carrier with<br>pad retaining pinBrake disc (vented) front<br> LUCAS 288X25 Polo/Derby/Vento-IND (PO) 2008 year volkswagen EUROPA 615025 spare parts
CrispyEdd
Member
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CrispyEdd
Member
I can report back now the systems fully bled and cars back on the road.
The front pads still have some bedding in to do.
The result is a noticeable and pleasing upgrade on standard brakes. A lot more feel control and ability to press lighter on the pedal but get good results. More like a modern car.
If you doing a suspension overhaul then I recommend this hub change and brake swap if you have tired brakes or a 90bhp diesel. These vrs brakes now feel like they were ment for the car.
The front pads still have some bedding in to do.
The result is a noticeable and pleasing upgrade on standard brakes. A lot more feel control and ability to press lighter on the pedal but get good results. More like a modern car.
If you doing a suspension overhaul then I recommend this hub change and brake swap if you have tired brakes or a 90bhp diesel. These vrs brakes now feel like they were ment for the car.
Howey
Member
Glad they are working a treat Ed!
However I would not class the standard brakes on an A2 as not performing like a modern car in fact the exact same discs and pads were fitted until very recently if they are not still factory fitted today.
I have found thou that the brakes on Mr Grey and Mr Black are noticeably better than Mr Silver despite Mr Silver having the best condition components. This makes me wonder if the vacuum connection to the tandem pump is the culprit, and not because you can rotate the housing connection necessarily
However I would not class the standard brakes on an A2 as not performing like a modern car in fact the exact same discs and pads were fitted until very recently if they are not still factory fitted today.
I have found thou that the brakes on Mr Grey and Mr Black are noticeably better than Mr Silver despite Mr Silver having the best condition components. This makes me wonder if the vacuum connection to the tandem pump is the culprit, and not because you can rotate the housing connection necessarily
BigBang
Active Member
256mm discs and FS-III calipers are fitted even today on polo, ibiza and fabia. The fuel you get is made by brake booster and overall component status. Therefore if you have leaky vacuum or weak vacuum pump your brakes will feel bad. If you have issues with rear brakes, yourbrakes will feel bad. If you have worn discs and pads, your brakes will feel bad. Even the thing like old brake hoses can make ypu brake to feel bad. I can say that brand new brakes and hoses on 2001 fabia and 2015 fabia feels almost identical except on 2015 have better first bite but it has discs in the rear. On my A2 they feel less bity and pedal has more travel that the two fabias. But on the other hand the longer travel positions the brake to the perfect foot position for heel & toe technique...
BTW: You dont need Fabia RS hubs. You can look for fabia 2 and rapid hubs for TDI. It has been equipped with the same 288mm brakes but for fraction of price compared to RS green calipers. Or at least here in CZ
BTW: You dont need Fabia RS hubs. You can look for fabia 2 and rapid hubs for TDI. It has been equipped with the same 288mm brakes but for fraction of price compared to RS green calipers. Or at least here in CZ
CrispyEdd
Member
This is very true, I agree, and I wouldnt have changed if not doing the full monty suspension overhaul and already had the calipers from a skoda to go on. Great info on the alternative hubs - thats very useful for anyone reading this in the future.256mm discs and FS-III calipers are fitted even today on polo, ibiza and fabia. The fuel you get is made by brake booster and overall component status. Therefore if you have leaky vacuum or weak vacuum pump your brakes will feel bad. If you have issues with rear brakes, yourbrakes will feel bad. If you have worn discs and pads, your brakes will feel bad. Even the thing like old brake hoses can make ypu brake to feel bad. I can say that brand new brakes and hoses on 2001 fabia and 2015 fabia feels almost identical except on 2015 have better first bite but it has discs in the rear. On my A2 they feel less bity and pedal has more travel that the two fabias. But on the other hand the longer travel positions the brake to the perfect foot position for heel & toe technique...
BTW: You dont need Fabia RS hubs. You can look for fabia 2 and rapid hubs for TDI. It has been equipped with the same 288mm brakes but for fraction of price compared to RS green calipers. Or at least here in CZ
One more bonus other than more power and easier braking is that if you do run 17's then the discs dont looko so silly behind them
, one for the cool club.
BigBang
Active Member
So true with the looks. Even behind my 16" it is starting to look silly. Also on my 80 Cabriolet the 256mm brakes look supersilly behind 18". Luckily they were replaced by 17" which are more appropriate 
I will post codes of the calipers, hubs and adaptors later today or tomorrow
I will post codes of the calipers, hubs and adaptors later today or tomorrow
When considering bigger front brake discs, it might be worth taking into account their weight to see how beefy you want to go.
The following weights were obtained from various Brembo front brake disc listings on autodoc.
The rather wimpy 239x18mm front brake discs were fitted to the Audi A2 1.2TDI (4/100 version) and the lowest power versions of the Polo MK4 and the various clones (5/100 version).
Weight of front brake discs
239x18mm 3.6kg (both 4/100 and 5/100 versions)
256x22mm 5.1kg
288x25mm 7.2kg
310x25mm 7.9kg (also known as 312x25mm)
The following weights were obtained from various Brembo front brake disc listings on autodoc.
The rather wimpy 239x18mm front brake discs were fitted to the Audi A2 1.2TDI (4/100 version) and the lowest power versions of the Polo MK4 and the various clones (5/100 version).
Weight of front brake discs
239x18mm 3.6kg (both 4/100 and 5/100 versions)
256x22mm 5.1kg
288x25mm 7.2kg
310x25mm 7.9kg (also known as 312x25mm)