A2 won't start. Starter motor?

richardbe

richardbe

Member
Hello All,

We’re having a starting problem with our A2.
Wife drove it home from work yesterday, 20-30 minute journey, pulled into our road and car stalled.
It wouldn’t restart and there was a bit of smoke from under the bonnet. Coolant & oil levels fine.
When turning key in ignition all dash lights come on then go off except EPC light now stays on.

IMG_9997.JPG


We jump started it from another car, ran fine for an hour (no EPC light), battery was charging so assuming this means alternator not faulty.

Battery reading is with car turned off 12.4v
Battery reading with engine running is 13-14v

Turned car off after an hour running (left it running to ensure battery was fully charged). Car wouldn’t restart.

Electrics all work ok, eg stereo runs fine, locks work, windows up/down ok
Car won’t start at all. Turn key and really slow crank for a few seconds then won't crank.

Replaced battery with brand new one, no difference.

I've done a video of trying to start:


Does it sound like the starter motor needs replacing? I can’t think what else it might be.

All help appreciated!
 
Have you checked the good old earth lead which runs from the starter motor to the chassis leg. Its easier to get access to it by removing the front passenger side headlight. It gets crudded up and perhaps the bolt needs taking out with a good rub down with emery cloth and a clean of the lead end onto the chassis.
 
Also recommend fitting a second earth lead from the offside engine mount bolt to the alternator carrier routing it behind the drivers side headlight......
 

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richardbe said:
Hello All,

We’re having a starting problem with our A2.
Wife drove it home from work yesterday, 20-30 minute journey, pulled into our road and car stalled.
It wouldn’t restart and there was a bit of smoke from under the bonnet. Coolant & oil levels fine.
When turning key in ignition all dash lights come on then go off except EPC light now stays on.

View attachment 109585

We jump started it from another car, ran fine for an hour (no EPC light), battery was charging so assuming this means alternator not faulty.

Battery reading is with car turned off 12.4v
Battery reading with engine running is 13-14v

Turned car off after an hour running (left it running to ensure battery was fully charged). Car wouldn’t restart.

Electrics all work ok, eg stereo runs fine, locks work, windows up/down ok
Car won’t start at all. Turn key and really slow crank for a few seconds then won't crank.

Replaced battery with brand new one, no difference.

I've done a video of trying to start:


Does it sound like the starter motor needs replacing? I can’t think what else it might be.

All help appreciated!
Click to expand...
certainly sounds like the starter earth needs to be examined and cleaned at the very least. Behaves usually as if battery has suddenly gone very bad despite everything else running seemingly normally until you try turning the engine over.
 
Dave M said:
Have you checked the good old earth lead which runs from the starter motor to the chassis leg. Its easier to get access to it by removing the front passenger side headlight. It gets crudded up and perhaps the bolt needs taking out with a good rub down with emery cloth and a clean of the lead end onto the chassis.
Click to expand...
I took the passenger headlight off to try to find the Earth point but couldn't see anything obvious. I used a jump lead from the engine block to the body (a bare metal bolt above headlight) and there was no difference.
 
The fault could be with the starter. There are a few areas that can cause problems. The positive lead being loose or corroded and the braided earth terminal between the solenoid and the starter corroded away.. The brushes could be worn out also.
 
richardbe said:
I took the passenger headlight off to try to find the Earth point but couldn't see anything obvious. I used a jump lead from the engine block to the body (a bare metal bolt above headlight) and there was no difference.
Click to expand...
For reference.

Earth tag below NS light?

Hi, Can someone tell me the exact location where the large Earth tag connection is supposed to be below the passengers side headlamp? Cause it looks like I don't have one. I have an intermittent misfire and I'd thought I try this mythical creature first. Photos would be good! I...
www.a2oc.net

Andy
 
richardbe said:
I took the passenger headlight off to try to find the Earth point but couldn't see anything obvious. I used a jump lead from the engine block to the body (a bare metal bolt above headlight) and there was no difference.
Click to expand...
Not sure above the headlight would be a suitable earth
 
Howey said:
Not sure above the headlight would be a suitable earth
Click to expand...
It's not "above the headlight". Trust me. I've had three bad starter motor earths on all three A2s. You take out the (UK) passenger side headlight, and once it is absent, go in under the a/c and ABS pipework. There is a thick black cable that comes sideways from the starter motor and is bolted into the chassis leg under these bits of kit. If the surface behind there is full of oxide and weld/scorch marks, your starting will be suspect no matter how good the battery is. If it can be unscrewed, sandpaper / abrasive Dremel head to both the chassis leg surface and the earth cable end giving clean surfaces sort out a lot of woes. Bear in mind that the cable itself can be faulty behind the insulation as has been reported here before so this needs to be examined as well and may need replacing if the contact point cleaning doesn't resolve issues.
 
Howey said:
Not sure above the headlight would be a suitable earth
Click to expand...
I think I've misread your post - apologies. You're talking about a novel earthing point above headlight being suspect - agreed. Supplementary earthing should only be done in logical positions.
 
Robin_Cox said:
I think I've misread your post - apologies. You're talking about a novel earthing point above headlight being suspect - agreed. Supplementary earthing should only be done in logical positions.
Click to expand...
Yeah I simply added another same as Dave M as I found the factory idea to be a pita. Later VAG cars have a very similar set up to this
 
Dave M said:
Have you checked the good old earth lead which runs from the starter motor to the chassis leg. Its easier to get access to it by removing the front passenger side headlight. It gets crudded up and perhaps the bolt needs taking out with a good rub down with emery cloth and a clean of the lead end onto the chassis.
Click to expand...

Right, I think I've found the earth point on my way to the starter motor, and it looks to be OK but will give it a clean up just to be sure.
 

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richardbe said:
Right, I think I've found the earth point on my way to the starter motor, and it looks to be OK but will give it a clean up just to be sure.
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Thats the very one. I had a car with this very problem, I replaced the whole earth strap with a new one, and when I stripped the old insulation off the original strap, it was HEAVILY corroded, all black and crusty, new cable fitted and boom, it starts first time every time now. ALthough, it could be the starter too...but the stalling bit has confused me as to why it would stall....it won't do any harm whatsoever to replace this achiles heel...
 
Are these earth straps available off the shelf? Would be v grateful if someone could post up a link and I can get one to put on.


I've got a new starter motor, and yesterday I followed this how to link,

https://workshop-manuals.com/audi/a...es_with_1.4_ltr._mpi_and_1.6_ltr._fsi_engine/

I've got everything undone and out of the way but admitted defeat at the bottom starter motor bolt which I couldn't shift without a deep 18mm socket. I can't see how I can get the old starter motor out and the new one in, there's so little room and so much in the way.
 
RAB said:
Be aware that whatever you do that the positive feed to the starter motor is live all the time. So if you work on the starter motor, disconnect the battery.

RAB
Click to expand...

Thanks! I've disconnected both sides of the battery, and touched them together to discharge.
 
Andrew said:
Good Afternoon,

I assume the earth strap is available from Audi/TPS but look at ebay, but you need to be forearmed with spec.

car earth strap for sale | eBay

Find great deals on eBay for car earth strap. Shop with confidence.
www.ebay.co.uk

Andy
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A local auto electrician will make one up using yours as a pattern. Also various lengths and end termination available at auto factors, ebay, and Amazon, etc. The length is not critical, near enough is OK, but must be at least the length of the original.
Mac.
 
Hello! It was a horrible job (especially in 30 degree heat) but I managed to replace the starter motor and now we have an A2 that starts and runs well again.
Which is nice!

If anyone is going to do this I'd recommend the 'how to' guide I linked to above in post 16, and I'd also recommend removing the passenger headlight to give another direction for poking a hand in.It's very tight and there's lots of stuff in the way, and everything you undo to move out of the way only moves a very small amount. There's only just enough room to lift the old starter motor out upwards and then lower the new one in.

IMG_0025 copy.JPG


IMG_0062 copy.JPG


I put a multi-meter onto both ends of the big earth cable and the reading was very close to zero so I reckoned that it's in OK condition. With the new starter motor there are no noticeable symptoms of it not being in good condition.
Thanks for all the help and advice!
 
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