Replacing suspension wishbones

spartacus 68

spartacus 68

Member
My wife's A2 (1.4 TDI 75PS) has now covered 140k miles. It's a 52 plate. I've replaced the front shocks previously and just renewed them last year with Meyle shocks after the MOT highlighted a weep on the N/S. In addition I fitted genuine Audi drop-links, coil springs and upper mount bearings. I did the ARB bushes a couple of years ago. The rear springs and shocks have also been renewed, again, possibly a couple of years ago.

We took the car last week on a 120 mile round trip and I was surprised at the ride quality, or rather lack of it. There's a definite shudder (always evident over cobbles or uneven road surface). The only thing that hasn't been replaced is the front wishbones. Are these straight-forward to replace, and any tips? Also, do Meyle or Lemforder make them, or is the preference to go for genuine Audi?

Anything else indeed to look for if I'm stripping the front suspension out again, subframe bushes, etc?
 
Go genuine. There are no subframe bushes, just the ones at the rear of teh wishbones. Big discussion on this over at the German forum right now, and the consensus is aftermarket parts aren't as accurate as they should be. Check also if they're the sheet metal or solid wishbones. Solid ones you can't change the ball joint on its own, with sheet metal ones you can.

- Bret
 
Hi Bret

Not sure if my memory is correct but did you change the gearbox 'dogbone' for similar reasons.


Cheers Spike
 
yes, and it helped at that point. I'd forgotten.

The recent shock change has also removed a very strong pickiness about wheel balancing; a 5g weight fell off one of the front wheels when we put them back on after the shock change and I can't feel any vibration @ 50mph. I was expecting vibration and was very surprised it wasn't there.

I don't know if the track rod ends were replaced or not, they could also be worn. Tracking may also be out. I would also not expect the original Audi droplinks to be good for more than two years. The Meyle HD ones are the only ones that have lasted more than one on my car here.

- Bret
 
Thank you for the replies. I did a little digging last night over old threads and stumbled upon the transmission mount. I'll keep it genuine on the wishbones too. It's solid ones that are on, so that's what's going back.

Tie-rods are original, so may change them too.
 
Quick update. Called Audi today, so they confirmed its the cast iron wishbones. Car is late 2002 model. Newer model from 2003 has pressed steel mounts with interchangeable lower ball joint.

Prices and part numbers as follows:

Wishbone right: 8Z0407152L, £188.00
Wishbone left: 8Z0407151L, £188.00
Control arm front lower bush: 8Z0407182C, £18.30 (x2)
Wishbone control arm bush: 8Z0407183A £23.15 (x2)

All plus VAT at 20%. I'll probably get 10% off prices as I'm a regular, but still, this is very expensive. Given the work involved to strip out the suspension, fitting the original wishbones seems a false economy.

I queried the suspension mount. Audi said there are four mounts listed for the model. What is the part number please. They didn't recognise the term dogbone transmission mount?
 
I think I've just had a lucky escape. My driver side front wishbone failed under braking today, luckily it was at low speed. This should have been spotted on the MOT just 6 months ago.
A2-2015-Wishbone-Fail.jpg
However, I can see from an early post that this ain't going to be a cheap fix but is it DIYable or do I need to get a professional to tackle it or worse is it just not worth it?
 
Don't get spooked by the Audi prices. There's a lot of discussion about pressed vs. forged wishbones, good makes vs. dodgy on the thread "Check your lower arms, people" (I don't have the skills to copy & paste a link, but it's not hard to find). IIRC, consensus is that Lemforder arms are at least equivalent to Audi's, and they possibly make them for Audi anyway. Also, for reasons you're all too well aware of, replace with forged rather than pressed. They fit right in.
They're not hard to fit. Do one side at a time; take out arm and console as a unit (be prepared to destroy the lower balljoint nut to get it off: it's probably rusted on and the ball joint pin will turn with the nut), get someone with a big press to push the new bush into the console, reassemble new arm with a bit of lube and a long clamp (I have the Audi-specified concentrate and used about 1% of what I bought to do both sides of mine) and then stuff it all back together with new bolts. I think if you take both consoles out at the same time, you lose subframe location. If the long thread holding the front bush into the console strips (a rusty end of the bolt may destroy the thread as you undo it), a good machine shop can put two long helicoils in and it'll be stronger than new.

I supported the car on the little plinths inboard of the jacking points, and I think that was OK.

Good luck. It's a v. satisfying job once you've done it.

Mike
 
Merlin3046 said:
Don't get spooked by the Audi prices. There's a lot of discussion about pressed vs. forged wishbones, good makes vs. dodgy on the thread "Check your lower arms, people" (I don't have the skills to copy & paste a link, but it's not hard to find). IIRC, consensus is that Lemforder arms are at least equivalent to Audi's, and they possibly make them for Audi anyway. Also, for reasons you're all too well aware of, replace with forged rather than pressed. They fit right in.
They're not hard to fit. Do one side at a time; take out arm and console as a unit (be prepared to destroy the lower balljoint nut to get it off: it's probably rusted on and the ball joint pin will turn with the nut), get someone with a big press to push the new bush into the console, reassemble new arm with a bit of lube and a long clamp (I have the Audi-specified concentrate and used about 1% of what I bought to do both sides of mine) and then stuff it all back together with new bolts. I think if you take both consoles out at the same time, you lose subframe location. If the long thread holding the front bush into the console strips (a rusty end of the bolt may destroy the thread as you undo it), a good machine shop can put two long helicoils in and it'll be stronger than new.

I supported the car on the little plinths inboard of the jacking points, and I think that was OK.

Good luck. It's a v. satisfying job once you've done it.

Mike
Click to expand...

Thanks, for the reassurance, Mike
Sadly, mine failed in a tricky place to do the work and I'm not sure I can move it again without some professional recovery assistance.

Since I posted (and read your response) I weighed up the options of borrowing my farmer friends trailer to recover up to his lockup/barn (about 25miles away) and have a crack at this me sen / against calling my local VAG specialist who does my servicing and has done a couple of these before (one quite recently). My local garage also reassured me it's not a big job, too. He also used aftermarket OEM parts which he's had no issues with... But I will ask which manufacturers part he intends to use before committing to his choice.

That said, I'll get this one done at the garage (little choice on the face of it) and then consider doing the other side me sen. I think it's safe to say the other one won't be far behind failing, either. But at least I don't have to urgently replace all the other aging interconnected parts (shocks, front discs, baking plates etc.) in one hit.
 
FYI - I deleted my earlier post because in my haste to solve a pressing problem (I needed to have the car recovered today, but to where?) I failed to fully read all the other threads available on this subject. However, having caught up, it’s clear that this is a very disturbing safety issue that’s being missed by too many MOT stations. It’s only just dawning on me how lucky we’ve been! - Prior to the failure at low speed just yards from home, we’d been to the Lakes and back on the busy A66... Last weekend we were in High Wycombe, up and down the M1 and M40. That’s a lot of chances for it to fail at speed in busy traffic. Jeez!

I’ve also realised, after closer inspection, some of the suppliers of the more reputable brands, including Lemforder at discounted prices, are actually European based warehouses with UK websites and are way too vague on delivery times.
 
Eventually, I ended up back at https://www.eurocarparts.com with a discount code (PAYDAY50). I bagged one for each side for £218.39 and they arrive tomoz morning for payment on collection from my local Eurocarparts depot in Harrogate. Cost of fitting is estimated at about £150 including tracking, both sides.

SHOPPING CART:
TRW Suspension Arm (Front Axle Right) Product Code: 615440716 - £167.99 with discount code down to £109
TRW Suspension Arm (Front Axle Left) Product Code: 615440706 - £167.99 with discount code down to £109

The suspension arms are listed as including rubber mounts but I figured I'd bag a couple of these, just in case (easy enough to return if not required)
2x Lemforder Control Arm / Wishbone Bush (Front Axle Lower Right or Left) Product Code: 610442055 - £16.99 each with discount code down to £11

All that said and done and even after reading countless sound arguments to swap to cast steel suspension arms (Lemforder or TRW) I have to say, I was very tempted to take up the offer of 2 genuine Audi pressed steel replacements from Germany (as posted by - CreweAudi on the 4th of May in https://www.a2oc.net/community/inde...our-front-suspension-arms-people.31963/page-8. For sure the failure of mine and others on here could have been catastrophic but when you consider they've been on the car for at least 12 years and done 140k miles in all whether (in my case) they've actually done well to last so long- Incidentally, there's no record of them ever being changed in my full-service history records.
 
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@treblezero the TRW arms come complete with the front bush, just check that the arm is correct for your vehicle. I have a TDi and I think the arm is marked TDi; anyway it is obvious if you have the correct one.

The additional bushes you have bought are the rear bushes that press into the console, they are not part of the arm. I would be very surprised, even for cash, if you will get both front arms, tracking and both console bushes for £150.

My console bushes were so badly seized I crushed my console in a 20T press. Had to buy new consoles but the experience of others has been that they can draw the bushes out with a simple bush replacement tool. My advice would be to check if your mechanic has budgeted for this part of the job and if not do not collect the bushes tomorrow. The originals are virtually bomb proof.
 
philward said:
@treblezero the TRW arms come complete with the front bush, just check that the arm is correct for your vehicle. I have a TDi and I think the arm is marked TDi; anyway, it is obvious if you have the correct one.

The additional bushes you have bought are the rear bushes that press into the console, they are not part of the arm. I would be very surprised, even for cash, if you will get both front arms, tracking and both console bushes for £150.

My console bushes were so badly seized I crushed my console in a 20T press. Had to buy new consoles but the experience of others has been that they can draw the bushes out with a simple bush replacement tool. My advice would be to check if your mechanic has budgeted for this part of the job and if not do not collect the bushes tomorrow. The originals are virtually bomb proof.
Click to expand...

So I've got my car back with the new arms fitted both sides. As you say, the new arms came complete with front bush. The other bushes are still good so they left them in. Fitting was £120 but I still need to get the tracking checked/done (extra £40ish), however, I need 2 new front tyres so I'm going to get them and the tracking done at the same time/place next week (once I've decided on tyres). The mechanic test drove it before handing back and said it felt good, sure-footed and no sign of drift (he's done a few in my town so he's familiar with the work - also an ex-Audi technician). The drive home felt good, if anything, a little tighter (in a good way), so I'm happy.

Interestingly, the other arm is relatively new so it must have been replaced just before I bought it 3 or 4 years ago. OK, with hindsight I coulda'/shoulda' just replaced the knackered one with a like-for-like genuine replacement from Crew Audi. But the total cost of replacing/refit would have been about the same as replacing both sides with cast steel arms, once you add in the extra ball joint and bush kit (sold separately). So yeah, on balance, It was a tough call. I guess the bonus is I can either keep hold of the good one and match it with another, should I decide to revert back in future (seems a bit pointless) or sell it

I matched the arm to my particular TDI using the EuroCarParts Car Reg checker so I'm confident I have the right ones for my model, if not I have some recourse with them, I guess
 
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philward said:
@treblezero tracking 50% off until 31st December at National Tyre with a voucher https://www.national.co.uk/special-offers

I think the Harrogate branch charged me £15.00.

Shame you didn't spot that new arm.
Click to expand...

I'll take advantage of that, thanks! Yeah. I didn't think to whip off the other wheel before it was recovered by the AA to the garage and it was getting late. But like I said, it was a close call based on available parts, time constraints and cost, It was about the same for just one side, anyway. I'm not going to dwell on it. ;-)
 
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