A2 - shocked

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Karcsi

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I've always thought of the A2 has the car I would buy once I moved from this God forsaken place (London). After reading all your comments, I cannot say that it serves as such a good advert for the poor car!

I perhaps wouldn't be so concerned if I would be buying new, and the criticisms were quite minor. But the car depreciates like a Vauxhall, and older versions of the A2 seemed to suffer from every fault under the sun; and not just minor ones either.

So far this forum is doing about as good a job as the Mercedes dealer that commented when the electric seat I was sitting on in a new C-class refused to respond, "God, that's the second time we've repaired that!".

My other choice, after having experience of driving quite a few care of Mr Stelios (best move M-B could have made) is the A Class.

Considering this an A2 fan site, I'm sure many of you considered the A Class and should have some choice words to convey. I'd be grateful to hear them.

Please don't tell me what I want to hear "The A2 is vastly superior in all respects compare to the hunk of junk the Benz is, and it brings you coffee in the morning"!


On the A2 front, I was considering the 1.6FSI over the 1.4TDI. I get the impression that no matter what Audi claim about the FSI, if you want to move reasonably in haste the fuel consumption will be sky high.

TIA
 
Karcsi,

Alas I do not believe this site was setup to advertise the A2, and if you only want to hear nice things you should visit your Audi dealer. As I’m sure you can imagine its difficult for a forum to exist over time with everyone just saying they are happy with their cars, so consequently its content comprises of many complaints. These however need to be reviewed in perspective because it could never be said that 50% of owners have experienced nasty faults, and more to the point I believe a fault that is swiftly fixed is hardly a nightmare situation.

From the odd breeze that I have had visiting different internet car forums I have yet to find one where praise is the only topic of discussion, and so I do not feel that it could be argued that brands X, Y & Z are seen to be so much better than an Audi, or A2. Moreover I doubt that you were attracted to the A2 because you had heard its headlights were never a problem, and I expect that like many owners the main attraction was the cars superb styling and body build quality. They are what the A2 is all about and I am not aware of that many posts on this forum that seek to challenge or undermine those qualities.

I always have believed that those who purchase an A2 generally are spell bound over the thought of ownership, and what I might say is that if the car does not appeal to your emotions then I doubt it is the car for you anyway.

Regards
John Disdale
 
Karcsi ... you should read this week's AutoExpress magazine as this has a direct comparison between the A2 1.6 FSI and the A-Class A160. Guess which one they prefer :)





Tino
Dolphin Grey 1.4 SE
 
Karcsi .....
we love the A2 i have Sex with my car ever morning lol!!!!!!
never a another car never never

1.6 FSI with all extras you can get

Thomas Giblin
 
The A2 is vastly superior in all respects compare to the hunk of junk the Benz is, and it brings you coffee in the morning


Just kidding.

I love my A2, I make quite a lot of miles with it. I've got it for 6 months now and it has 25000 km on it. What makes the A2 special is the design, people actually stop and stare at the A2 when I drive by. Or at the motorways people sometime drive besides me with their jaws hanging wide open.

Apart from the design teh car is nice and solid to drive, last week I had to drive from Rotterdam to Groningen (a 250 Km trip) so I had to sit in the A2 for 5 hours. I never got tired of the car, my back didn't hurt and I felt safe and comfortable the whole ride.

Sure the A2 has some perks and some problems, mine was 4 days old when the turbo blew up....

My advise would be to testdrive both cars and decide which one fits you better.

Good luck !

Dennis de Held

Amulet Red 1.4 Tdi
 
Thanks y'all!

I realise that a forum is usually used as a place to air problems and seek answers. But this is a fan site. I would have expected more praise than problem sharing.

My parents bought an A4 last year, and the local dealership in Worcester (Listers) have been absolutely brilliant. There were a few things wrong with it (asthetically) on delivery, which they rectified quickly and without complaint. But since then not a fault, and the interior is certainly of the highest quality. The Beemer 3 and Merc C that they test drove before deciding on the A4 were pretty shabby in comparison, and so was the snooty attitude of the dealerships.

So what attracts me to the A2 is the cute looks, external size vs interior dimensions, practicality, frugality, and the above experiences. What I don't like is the tiny rear window, height/width ratio (are we sure they are not more prone to tpping over than the A Class?), depreciation. Now add to that dodgy build quality and iffy engines.

However, I will book a test drive for the weekend and see what they are like to drive. Despite being narrower, taller and longer than the A class (not a good receipe for better handling), they seem to be closer to the ground, and better sprung. Perhaps it's handling and character will win me over.
 
Conserning the Handling I have to say in comparsion to the A-Class the A2, I thought, handles much better thanks in effect to ESP, ABS, ASR, which control the car nicely. In fact I love the way it flies through long sharp bends. U said the A2 is higher than the A-Class??!?!?! If u say so it sure doesn't feel that way to me. In fact the added lenght might help a bit to sort that out. Concerning build quality, I guess u can luck or not. In my case I definetly can not complain everything feels like an Audi to me and surely u can not say that the A-Class is of high quality, especially when turning to the interior. There is alot of cheap looking plasitc here!
The Engines seems to be problem for some people, which I really do not understand! When ever u read a general review of the car it is almost always written, that the small variety of engines is not a positive point. Nonetheless, I found that especially the 1.4TDI gives u anything u need from a car that size. It's very economical, surely has enough power despite the seemingly small 75bhp (it almost has 200nm and driven to full easily goes to 190km/h on my speedometer, which is the equivalent of 115mph. Sure that is my speedo but still it's definetly fast enough for England and speeding from low revs and in town see the almost 200nm)and even despite it being a 3cylinder engine great to drive on long distances. I have been doing 6000miles on the Autobahn in Germany within the last 3months - mostly long distance stuff - and I really would not want to go back to my 3 Series beamer that is for sure.
Finally, u r right before getting the A2 I also looked into the A-Class, as alot of people probably did who eventually bought the A2. But the single most important thing that deterred me from the A-Class were the - at least in Germany - extremely high costs for most repairs. For expample I was quoted 1200 Euros for a clutch incl. fitting, which from my point of view is out of the question. The reason for the high prices is the so called "Sandwich build", where the engine is - to a great extend - below the passenger cabin, making it most difficult to fix or change anything.
Right I hope I bombarded u enough with my oppion, which I have to point out it is! As u can see I am very much happy with the car and could not imagine having anything else at the moment. In conclusion I think it is the perfect fusion of long distance car, city car and people/stuff mover.
Have at ur test drive!!

A2 1.4TDI Silver, climate control, still fairly standard :(
 
Don't buy a TDI I don't think it is sutiable for Town driving especialy in London


1.4 tdi owner
 
Cheers McMuffin

I think the Audi chassis is lower to the ground, and so has a lower centre of gravity.

Even though the A2 seems smaller than the A Class, I think it's quite a bit bigger (in small car terms anyway). How useful is the boot space with 4 up (all seats occupied)?

Is the engine in the A2 positioned quite normally then? I thought, due to the snub nose and the height of the seats, that it would be similar to the A class - half of the mechanics under your bum.


Ok, it seems perhaps the A-class is not a match for the A2. So then which engine should I go for? It's either the TDI or the 1.6. Rather than 0-60 times, I'm more interested in in-gear acceleration. I test drove a 1.8 audi A4, but the engine is the weediest piece of rubbish I've come across. It may have 125 horses, but you have to spin it to death to get anything from it - and it sounds awful. Is the A2 1.6 similar? There have been reviews that said that it was a bit lacklustre and obnoxiously noisey when worked hard. And that it likes the demon drink quite a bit more than is claimed.
 
Wants wrong with the TDI and town driving? Too easy to stall it, hence a lot of leg work to play with the clutch? Diesels are generally more difficult to get moving smoothly, you do need to watch the revs a bit more than with a petrol engine. I guess maybe the small engine is more difficult still.
 
Just been looking at C3 prices (VAT free for a new one!). Any opinions?

The back end of the C3 is very similar to the A2, don't you think? OK, I'll go and get my eyes tested.
 
Where it was said that the TDI was not so good on London’s streets I fairly presume that the comment was based upon the diesel being more nosier than its 1.4 petrol equivalent. The latter being extremely quite and unfussy when travelling at 30/35mph in top gear. Having never driven an FSI I do not know how this would compare to the diesel, when it has been said in magazines that the FSI can become noisy when pushed. The point here though is that the car would not be “pushed” when trickling along in London’s busy traffic.

As I have mentioned in other topics if travel is mainly made over very short distances (like 2 miles) then I doubt that there is a great difference in fuel consumption for this to be a major factor in what engine to choose. Furthermore it is my opinion that on short journeys like this the diesel engine feels more like a dead slug until some warmth in the engine has built up, and so under these circumstances I would say petrol is best.

In reading the comment that diesel engines are more easy to stall, I believe the exact opposite is the case with the A2 – although for all I know the differences between hard linkages versus fly by wire on the accelerator pedal might be a contributory factor. Mind you with clutches seeming to vary from car to car perhaps its impossible to pinpoint or to make a valid conclusion.

Regards
John Disdale
 
In my opinion the C3 looks more like the New Beetle!!
But back to real cars!!! ;)

As for the TDI I have to agree with John. If u'r only looking for a car to go around London, then the TDI probably is not the prefered choice over the standard 1.4. It's just not enough milage to cover the extra cost of the Diesel (higher Diesel price compared with petrol in the UK and I am not sure what it's like in GB but in Germany the TDI costs a good bit more than the standard 1.4) In terms of in gear excelleration, though, the TDI is brilliant. Low revs but still enough grunt. (again see the 200nm of torque in comparison with just 126nm for the petrol). But if u plan to be driving quite a bit, then my suggestion still would be the TDI. Oh yes and I have not found the TDI easy to stall, it actually seems very forgiving!
As for the FSI, there is not an aweful lot I can say, just what I read in various articles about the FSI in the A2 or in general (Lupo or Golf). The main points here r that it seems alot of fun to drive, but has some downsides. When pushed it is supposed to get a bit loud - as u said - and then also gussles quite a bit. The main advantage of the FSI is the mid section of usage (so called Teillastbereich in German if ur interested in it). In other words if ur cruising along on motorways or country roads, then the fuel consumption is supposed to be quite a lot better than with normal petrol engines.
The conclusion of most articles so far was that it is a step into the right direction but still needs some refinement till it's completely superior to the standard petrol.

A2 1.4TDI Silver, climate control, still fairly standard :(
 
Karcsi
Interesting comments/observations you made. If you did a quick poll of everyone on this forum, you wouldn't be met with 100% hate for the A2 and it's problems. Indeed, in the big scheme of things, if you take total A2 ownership versus forum members I think you'll find the % very low.

After I bought my A2, Audi had a research company telephone me and ask questions about my A2 ownership. When I put the phone down, only once did I not give the A2 full marks and this was for front vision through the thick windscreen pillars. I suprised myself that when you sit down and think about it, the A2 is a marvelous little machine.

A lot of problems stem from dealer attitude-OK in my case both my A2's have had problems outside of the delaers control, but the problems that were delaer initiated, and where they have taken more than one attempt to fix something and do all this without a hint of sorrow for the poor sod driving the car and giving them a living by supporting the dealer is not the A2's fault (come on down Robinsons Audi, Norwich).

If a company makes a mistake, but then rectifies that misatke with more gusto, you will think 100 times more of that company. That is the real customer satisfaction test. If Audi UK along with it's dealers sat back and took more notice of this they would sell even more cars (A2 included).

Being honest, if you have a good time with a company and it's product, you tell 10 people. You have a crap time and you tell 50. It's the way we are, we all want to warn one another about the dangers and that's why this forum is such a great community-we all look out for each other.

Above all, most of us love the A2 and the A2 concept (as in Audi's marketing/design aim). Why else did I accept a replacement A2 instead of demanding a refund of my money?. Individual lemons will happen with all car makes.

As for the A-class, don't forget that Stelios is off-loading his A-class fleet and moving to mainstream models-honestly the rediuals are even worse than an A2. Plus, and it's said in many motoring reviews, that the A-class was one of the last of the recent poor-build mercs. Mercedes went through a cost-cutting wave in the 90's, and the A-class suffered (as did many other merc models). Only recently have Mercedes upped the quality after the bad press and people voting with their feat.

Good luck whatever you choose.

Steve - 2003 1.4SE petrol, Silver, black/black interior
 
I had a 1.6Aclass, now an A2 owner, and in a nutshell the audi A2 sport is much better, handling speed comfort, extras!!! No conparison!

A2 1.6fsi sport climate cd amulet red
 
Just to add another positive note we have hasd ours for 6 weeks now, no problems and wife's only complaint is that it does not accelerate as fast as the previous 2.0 206 - but then we wanted a well built car which was more practical, cheaper to insure and had four adult sized seats and a boot.

I am watching for any of the problems detailed on the site but so far none have appeared. We do have the old wiper but that doesn't worry me.

Ian

2002 1.4 Petrol SE, silver with climate control.
 
Karcsi,
I have never 'slagged off' my A2 in these 'pages' and would never do so. I amd quite a few others have sound, reliable cars which do as advertised and are step ahead. Some others have suffered some early model setbacks and have been forthright in their raising of issues. Check out the MINI website to see some real problems.....in volume I might add.
Test it, enjoy it and make your own informed decision.
The TDI is a good town tool, slick clutch excellent gearbox and the ability to leave it in 3rd and blitz othere traffic. It is a competent cruiser and a surprisingly good tool around the twisties to boot.
It is a cracking car. (statement 6 or 7 on these sheets)
I have told you guys before that we ( and I mean we as I contribute too) come across to others as a byunch of whingers with the worst motor vehicle ever invented. But we know it is a De Lorean!

icon_smile_cool.gif
 
Karcsi,

I had an A Class AFTER rejecting two A2's. It pains me to repeat what I've written before but you asked the question.

First, Merc have I believe solved their quality problems. Mine was an A170 CDI Elegance Long wheelbase and (aside from my 320D BMW) is the only car I've had never to need anything done under warranty (and whilst I'm sure I've not owned the number of cars John D has fore my age I'm doing well).

The A2 is a better drivers car but in my opinion not substantially so. I also believe that the cabin in the A Class whilst not of the same quality materials is actually a nicer place to be.

AS I've said before the A Class wins for me on ride quality, packaging, equipment and choice of trims. It also wins on space (for the LWB). The A2 is a better drive and a better steer but as an ownership prospect it was a dead loss. Two cars rejected within 12 months.

And from what I've read about residuals neither cars are as good as they are expected to be. Stelios' fleet may harm the A Class but it won't affect the newest models and not the CDi or LWB.

The other thing I believe strongly is that while the Merc may have HAD quality problems at least (and you could see this as good or bad) the problems could be different from car to car. With the A2 we see the same old problems time and time again years after launch.

What I also feel is that both cars are way too expensive. Theres a lot of metal you can buy for the price of a decent specced A2.

Of course if you want a really good car you should buy a Smart. One month into ownership and I have to say the best car my wife and I have ever owned.
 
OK. Everyone has succeeded to put more put me off the A2 rather than encourage me to buy one. Adding that to what I believe is a small underpowered engine, I've decided to go for a diesel A3 instead.

But, where are all the diesel A3s? I would like to get a 1.9TDi 130 Sport/SE 5-dr for less than £15,000. There are quite a few nearly new 3 doors about for £15k - mainly from Tins. But hardly any 5 doors, or any more than 6 months old. I thought the 130 version has been available since around July 2001? Where are they then?
 
Sad to say, as another initially enthusiastic potential A2 buyer, after reading views on this Forum, I'm becoming inclined to Karcsi's way of thinking. Though I still think it's a beautiful thing and may yet take the plunge!!
 
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