My wife's A2 is just 5 years old with a full ASH. It has done just 28000 miles and last week when it was being serviced we were told it needed it's power steering replaced at an approximate cost of £1130! Given the mileage it's done and the ASH is this reasonable? we think not. Audi through the dealer do not want to know. I have just sent a registered letter to Jeremy Hicks- MD of Audi UK asking for his opinion. I expected at the least Audi to get one of their engineers to inspect the vehicle - are we being fair? Your thoughts greatly appreciated.
Power Steering
- Thread starter teejaybee
- Start date
Welcome to the A2OC.
As it's not a 'wear and tear' item like clutches or brakes, I think you could reasonably expect the power steering system to last a minimum of 10 years or 100.000 miles. On this basis it would be fair to expexct Audi to contribute at least 50% of the cost of your repair.
Find out what needs replacing - there have been a few posts recently about steering pump failures which cost around £750 to fix so this may be a common (design or quality) problem. This could be good ammunition for your claim.
The cost quoted for your repair means they must be changing some other major parts - like the steering rack. Make them justify their diagnosis.
Go to another dealer for a second opinion - without giving them any background info. This should confirm whether the first estimate is correct.
We would be very interested to hear how you progress
Good Luck Spike
As it's not a 'wear and tear' item like clutches or brakes, I think you could reasonably expect the power steering system to last a minimum of 10 years or 100.000 miles. On this basis it would be fair to expexct Audi to contribute at least 50% of the cost of your repair.
Find out what needs replacing - there have been a few posts recently about steering pump failures which cost around £750 to fix so this may be a common (design or quality) problem. This could be good ammunition for your claim.
The cost quoted for your repair means they must be changing some other major parts - like the steering rack. Make them justify their diagnosis.
Go to another dealer for a second opinion - without giving them any background info. This should confirm whether the first estimate is correct.
We would be very interested to hear how you progress
Good Luck Spike
My wife works for Consumer Direct - a part of Trading Standard. Her advice would be.
A steering system on a car is expected to be durable. This means it should last for more than 28000 miles. Under your statutory rights, the Sale of Goods Act states products should be fit for purpose and durable. As the steering system obviously isn't I would ask for a full repair or replacement at no cost to the consumer and at no significant inconvienience to the consumer. Write a recoreded delivery letter to the service manager of your Audi dealer quoting the above and giving them a timescale for response. These are your rights under law.
Always ask for the full cost - you may not get it but it's worth trying, especially if you quote Consumer Direct & Trading Standards.
A steering system on a car is expected to be durable. This means it should last for more than 28000 miles. Under your statutory rights, the Sale of Goods Act states products should be fit for purpose and durable. As the steering system obviously isn't I would ask for a full repair or replacement at no cost to the consumer and at no significant inconvienience to the consumer. Write a recoreded delivery letter to the service manager of your Audi dealer quoting the above and giving them a timescale for response. These are your rights under law.
Always ask for the full cost - you may not get it but it's worth trying, especially if you quote Consumer Direct & Trading Standards.
Hi teejaybee
Any news on your power steering problems ?
I had always assumed the system was electrically assisted but a check on the parts and service manuals shows it has a conventional hydraulic steering rack and the only difference to a conventional system is the electric motor driven steering pump. The pump and reservoir unit are hidden under the passenger side headlight unit, accessible for checking and topping up is by removal of the front wheel and inner plastic arch. Neither the rack or the pump unit are serviceable - so if a seal goes, you throw the lot away (how thoughtful Mr Audi)
If you end up having the rack and/or the pump replaced and you can get the parts back, I would love to have a look at them. If you could be bothered to do this, I would be happy to pay the postage costs.
Cheers Spike
Any news on your power steering problems ?
I had always assumed the system was electrically assisted but a check on the parts and service manuals shows it has a conventional hydraulic steering rack and the only difference to a conventional system is the electric motor driven steering pump. The pump and reservoir unit are hidden under the passenger side headlight unit, accessible for checking and topping up is by removal of the front wheel and inner plastic arch. Neither the rack or the pump unit are serviceable - so if a seal goes, you throw the lot away (how thoughtful Mr Audi)
If you end up having the rack and/or the pump replaced and you can get the parts back, I would love to have a look at them. If you could be bothered to do this, I would be happy to pay the postage costs.
Cheers Spike
Power steering problem
I am still awaiting to find out how much it will cost me.
Few weeks agao I suddenly find it was difficult to turn my steering when reversing and slowly turn into difficult to steer at low speed. Checked the normal stuff like tyre pressure, etc. Eventually took mine into the local audi service centre and was advised that the fluid was very low, so it was not the £700 pump. But they found no obvious leak either so they have booked my car in for for 3 days so they can have a full checkup on it (engine stripped and so on). The lady at the desk told me they have never encounter a problem like mine so I am now dreading on how much it will cost me. I am thinking of contacting Audi as it was only 6 months after the warranty, and it is a major safety problem (cannot turn steering). What do you think my chances are for they to contribute toward the cost of repairing?
Regards,
Vinnyk
I am still awaiting to find out how much it will cost me.
Few weeks agao I suddenly find it was difficult to turn my steering when reversing and slowly turn into difficult to steer at low speed. Checked the normal stuff like tyre pressure, etc. Eventually took mine into the local audi service centre and was advised that the fluid was very low, so it was not the £700 pump. But they found no obvious leak either so they have booked my car in for for 3 days so they can have a full checkup on it (engine stripped and so on). The lady at the desk told me they have never encounter a problem like mine so I am now dreading on how much it will cost me. I am thinking of contacting Audi as it was only 6 months after the warranty, and it is a major safety problem (cannot turn steering). What do you think my chances are for they to contribute toward the cost of repairing?
Regards,
Vinnyk
Hi vinnyk
With no obvious leaks my guess would be the steering rack seals are worn/damaged and fluid is leaking into the rubber bellows at either end of the rack.
I would take Rob Earl's advice and go for the full cost of any repair. If this type of negotiation does not come easy to you, contact your local Citizens Advice Centre or even try the Legal Advice line of your insurance company for clarification of your rights - they may even help you compose the letter.
In the meantime, document every discussion with your dealer - contact names, times, what was discussed etc. Ask for a written report, listing the failed parts and reason for failure - ensure you get any failed parts back.
Be polite in all your discussions.
Cheers Spike
With no obvious leaks my guess would be the steering rack seals are worn/damaged and fluid is leaking into the rubber bellows at either end of the rack.
I would take Rob Earl's advice and go for the full cost of any repair. If this type of negotiation does not come easy to you, contact your local Citizens Advice Centre or even try the Legal Advice line of your insurance company for clarification of your rights - they may even help you compose the letter.
In the meantime, document every discussion with your dealer - contact names, times, what was discussed etc. Ask for a written report, listing the failed parts and reason for failure - ensure you get any failed parts back.
Be polite in all your discussions.
Cheers Spike
Thanks
Thanks to all who have contributed to my powersteering saga. The more I think about it the more I am convinced it is a problem I should not be faced with and I am not going to take it lying down. I have sent a registered letter to Jeremy Hicks (Audi MD) I called him today but he was not in, I have discovered his email address and have just sent him an email. There is another letter ready to be sent out claiming the repair costs under the Sale of Goods Act, I am quite prepared to take Audi to the small claims court and I can also claim damages as the purchase is less then 6 years old.
I am hoping this can be avoided but I have no doubt that should it have to go before the court they, being "members of the public" will come down on the side of the little man against a big conglomerate.
I think it will be a shame if Audi do not choose to co-operate all I know is they certainly have a fight on their hands now! Power to the people!!
Thanks to all who have contributed to my powersteering saga. The more I think about it the more I am convinced it is a problem I should not be faced with and I am not going to take it lying down. I have sent a registered letter to Jeremy Hicks (Audi MD) I called him today but he was not in, I have discovered his email address and have just sent him an email. There is another letter ready to be sent out claiming the repair costs under the Sale of Goods Act, I am quite prepared to take Audi to the small claims court and I can also claim damages as the purchase is less then 6 years old.
I am hoping this can be avoided but I have no doubt that should it have to go before the court they, being "members of the public" will come down on the side of the little man against a big conglomerate.
I think it will be a shame if Audi do not choose to co-operate all I know is they certainly have a fight on their hands now! Power to the people!!
hollyrescue
Member
The small claims court holds no terror for you It takes place in a small room with you, them and a judge in a suit. The other side often doesnt bother to turn up. In which case yoyu win, so TURN UP. No legal eagles allowed. Documentation is all important and vital, so it must be complete. Phone calls are fine if a record is kept and agreed (it rarely is agreed) so stick to letters, including, "confirming our telephone conversation of today...." or "confirming our e-mail correspondence, copies attached....". You can see that real letters are best. The judge will say "I have read your corrspondence, have you anything to ADD", don't waste his time if you've done the job right only later correspendence or contact will be relevant. He will then say the same to the other side. Then pronounce judgement.
I did quite a few in my previous job, I doubt if the procedures have changed, only the amount involved to be eligible for small claims. There is of course no appeal because you both agree to accept his judgement. All very civilised, especially if you win, but you can only lose the fee paid to enter the claim, because Audi have no claim on you.
Remember to claim against the relevant party, not Audi, they didnt sell you the car, but their comments are valid if they make any.
Good luck.
I did quite a few in my previous job, I doubt if the procedures have changed, only the amount involved to be eligible for small claims. There is of course no appeal because you both agree to accept his judgement. All very civilised, especially if you win, but you can only lose the fee paid to enter the claim, because Audi have no claim on you.
Remember to claim against the relevant party, not Audi, they didnt sell you the car, but their comments are valid if they make any.
Good luck.
Nothing much has changed even though the county court(small claims court) now comes under "Her Majestys Court Service" and is part of the department of constitutional affairs. You can go on line and make your claim if you wish, all the relevant paperwork can be downloaded these days. I would suggest you also get from the "Community legal service"or your local County Court a free booklet called "Problems with goods and services, your legal rights". It's free and very informative. The leaflet number is 13. It's written in crystal clear english of a medium register and is therefore easy to understand.hollyrescue said:
I would endorse everything said by the previous poster, the most important being, a register of all communications and responses, and, that you should turn up for the hearing. Sounds silly I know but you would be amazed at the number of people who don't !
Good luck in your endeavers and keep us informed of your progress.
Herewith relevant sites.
[email protected] or phone 0845 3000 343
www.hmcourts-service.gov.uk
hollyrescue
Member
Looks like some good up-date advice from Old Git. So thats 2 old gits on your side!
hollyrescue
Member
I doubt if you could make it stick to Audi. You need advice on that one, trading standards or similar in line with previous advice. One thing is for sure the claim must be against the right organisation or you fail, their defence being "nothing to do with me guvnor". Don't give up, plenty of moral support from A2oc and there are some legal brains in the family, who may respond.
After a quick question & answer session with the wife, the consumers issue is with the dealer, not the manufacturer. The dealer will have to recoup any outlay back from Audi UK by their own means.
Always go to the first line (shop, dealer etc), not the maker.
Another point. Legal representation IS allowed in the small claims court if you so desire. And if the other party fail to turn up to court, you are NOT guaranteed a win. It's very likely you will win but not guaranteed.
Always go to the first line (shop, dealer etc), not the maker.
Another point. Legal representation IS allowed in the small claims court if you so desire. And if the other party fail to turn up to court, you are NOT guaranteed a win. It's very likely you will win but not guaranteed.
hollyrescue
Member
Rob, True with regard to not turning up, but in every one of my cases where that happened I was told "the other party hasn't turned up, judgement is in your favour" I suppose a good excuse is OK, like sickness etc. (not acceptable when a company is involved) but my opponents offered no excuse.
I always thought that the whole idea of the small claims court (or whatever they call it now) was no legal reps allowed at the hearing to keep costs and arguments down, the documentation was all, with a "have you any questions to ask the other side?" Things may have changed since I did it so I'm not adamant on the legal rep aspect, but it would be a fundamental change undermining the whole concept.
I am sure that within the A2OC family some good advice is available, probably more up to date than mine.
I always thought that the whole idea of the small claims court (or whatever they call it now) was no legal reps allowed at the hearing to keep costs and arguments down, the documentation was all, with a "have you any questions to ask the other side?" Things may have changed since I did it so I'm not adamant on the legal rep aspect, but it would be a fundamental change undermining the whole concept.
I am sure that within the A2OC family some good advice is available, probably more up to date than mine.
Having never done any small claims myself, I'm only repeating what my wife had told me.
I always thought the small claims court was purley the two sides & a judge/magistrate. But it appears you can have representation if you want - probably at your own expense and therefore negating the part of the settlement in the first place. Hence why it's not seen very often.
I always thought the small claims court was purley the two sides & a judge/magistrate. But it appears you can have representation if you want - probably at your own expense and therefore negating the part of the settlement in the first place. Hence why it's not seen very often.
The story so far......
Thanks to everyone who replied to my query, Audi UK have offered me the next service free and the dealer where we bought it from is going to confirm what needs doing and then discount the repair "as much as they can". I think we will wait and see what the final price is before I accept so watch this space......
teejaybee said:
Thanks to everyone who replied to my query, Audi UK have offered me the next service free and the dealer where we bought it from is going to confirm what needs doing and then discount the repair "as much as they can". I think we will wait and see what the final price is before I accept so watch this space......