Worth considering a CAT N / total loss car?

R

rain.parade

Member
Hi all - I've been on the lookout for my first A2 for a while, and a couple of weeks ago I was talking to the seller of this car, as It's pretty close to me, but I got put off after a check I did showed up it had been an insurance total loss in 2015.

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The loss was a CAT D (repairable damage) which I believe predates the newer, more specific CAT S / N classifications, and I'm wondering whether it might still be worth considering if I could get the price knocked down, maybe to sub £1k? I'd want to get the car looked at anyway, which would presumably highlight any structural concerns, but I'm just interested to hear experience / advice on what impact on price I'd expect to see on a car of this age / milage.

According to the seller, he'd been working on the car as a retirement project since buying it in 2018, which aligns with the MOT history as It hadn't been tested between then and getting an MOT in Jan this year. It also seems to have done over 20k miles since the write-off, mostly before the current owner acquired it.

Of course, It could be academic anyway if the seller doesn't want to budge on the price!
 
CatD was normally just an insurance company opinion that the vehicle was uneconomic to repair (typically cosmetic damage). If the damage had been anything to real 'worry abou't the loss category would have been higher.
 
rain.parade said:
Hi all - I've been on the lookout for my first A2 for a while, and a couple of weeks ago I was talking to the seller of this car, as It's pretty close to me, but I got put off after a check I did showed up it had been an insurance total loss in 2015.

Used Audi Cars for Sale in Fakenham, Norfolk | Gumtree

Find amazing local prices on used Audi cars for sale in Fakenham, Norfolk ✅ Shop hassle-free with Gumtree, your local buying & selling community.
www.gumtree.com www.gumtree.com

The loss was a CAT D (repairable damage) which I believe predates the newer, more specific CAT S / N classifications, and I'm wondering whether it might still be worth considering if I could get the price knocked down, maybe to sub £1k? I'd want to get the car looked at anyway, which would presumably highlight any structural concerns, but I'm just interested to hear experience / advice on what impact on price I'd expect to see on a car of this age / milage.

According to the seller, he'd been working on the car as a retirement project since buying it in 2018, which aligns with the MOT history as It hadn't been tested between then and getting an MOT in Jan this year. It also seems to have done over 20k miles since the write-off, mostly before the current owner acquired it.

Of course, It could be academic anyway if the seller doesn't want to budge on the price!
Click to expand...
My A2 was a CATN when i bought it just because a post van reversed into it and split the offside wing. N stands for 'non structural' in the new system so as long as theres no trim hanging and dragging it should be fine as long as your willing to put some work and money into the athstetics.
Plus its a good thing to use to barter down with too if you want to.
 
I'd say if the damage was in 2015 and its been used for the last 8 years without a problem and passed MOTs OK then go for it, nothing to be worried about at all! I think a lot of cars probably get non structural damage and are repaired without going through the insurance so you'd never know!!
FYI I do think its overpriced (unless there are receipts for lots of work) as I paid a similar price for mine in November, looks a similar spec but mine had 132k miles (think that ones close to 200k!) and no previous insurance writeoff
 
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I bought an Audi 80 quattro Sport back in '93. I didn't HPI check it until after I'd bought it, as you do. My heart sank when I found it had been written off.
I rang the owner who had it at the time of write off and found out the back story. Only extensive panel damage, caused by a drink driver near Headingly cricket ground, 5 cars were hit. It had been bought back, repaired and had passed several MOTs.
If you don't mind the "write off" stigma, can be a good buy.
 
Shouldn't be a problem with it being CATN. I can't see it in the ad but it should be made clear.
There will always be a stigma attached to it. That could play in your favour. Check it out and make an offer based on condition - damage history and be prepared to walk away. It may be accepted. It does seem expensive.
There are lots of crash damaged cars that have been repaired that aren't even classified and others that have been written off more than once.
Condition/evidence of previous maintenance is key.
My concern is more about the gear change problem. There will always be another one for sale which isn't far away. Don't travel too far to find a "dog" - I've done that!
 
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If you use your car as a van then the weight difference between removal the bench seat compared to the single rear seats maybe something to consider?
 
I'd want to be very sure that the repairs were carried out to a high standard, and even then not sure I'd go for it.
Is there any kind of an insurance issue?
 
Thanks all for the responses. The seller claims not to have known about the insurance write-off. That's certainly possible as it occurred a couple of years and MOT's before he took ownership, and apparently the car was taken as part-payment against some work he'd done.

I've personally not got an issue with any stigma (assuming there's no permanent damage), particularly on a vehicle of that age and cost, but obviously it would likely put off some future buyers, so I would need to factor in an appropriate adjustment on what I'd be prepared to pay.

I'm going to take a look tomorrow, but I'm not holding out a lot of hope, and I'm expecting I'll probably give it a miss once I've seen it. He's indicated he may accept 'sensible' offers, but also that his price reflects the cost he's put into parts sorting out the suspension, ABS and brakes, which he wants to recoup. Combined with the high-milage, insurance write-off, non working AC, 3rd gear issue an anything else, I suspect any price he'd be will to accept wouldn't be worth the potential work / risk for me to take on. We'll see, but if nothing else it will will give me a benchmark for viewing other cars.
 
Quick update on this. I went to look at the car yesterday - I was upfront with the seller that I thought the amount he was looking to recoup was probably a fair bit over what It would be worth to me, but he was a very friendly chap and happy for me to take a look over it anyway.

There’s a bit of a dent/bulge in the n/s front bumper, which can be seen from the pictures, and there’s also a small crack when you look up close. That may well be related to the Cat D I guess. There are also some minor scrapes on the front wings, plus the alloys could do with a refurb and are missing their caps (also I’m not sure the 7-spoke wheels would have been original to the car?) - all of which contributes to it looking slightly scruffy, but in-line with what you’d expect from a 23 year old car. I also noticed a bit of condensation inside the headlights. The interior is actually really nice - the seats are really clean, there’s no headliner sag, and the hard plastics mean the touch controls are in very decent nick. It does, however, have an aftermarket stereo and seems to be missing the false boot floor and parcel shelf.

He had all the receipts for the suspension and brake parts he’d replaced, plus cam belt kit, and still had all of the removed parts in his garage! Given that I wasn’t looking to buy at that point I didn’t ask for a test drive, but the car started and ran smoothly, and the engine bay was tidy (caveat - I’m mechanically minded, but I’m no car expert).

The lowest the seller said he was willing to go to was £900. In some ways that seemed tempting given the work that’s been done to he suspension and brakes, plus new cam belt and water pump, and given that it’s MOT’d until next Jan. On the other hand, there are other cars currently for sale around the £1k mark (although not close to me) that seem better on paper with lower miles, better history, and presumably not previous total loss.
 
You're right, those aren't original A2 rims, they are at least reasonably sympathetic though. Another consideration for you - I notice it's an early TDI, was it on an X or a Y plate under the masking? If it's a Y then no problem, but remember that all X-plated TDI's were registered before 1st March 2001 so they are are subject to vehicle tax at £200 annual rate, not £35. I notice too that it's a 5-seater. If you don't actually need three rear seats (only one of which can actually take a child seat) then a 4-seater is a much more flexible arrangement and a lot easer to get into 'van mode'.

All of that said, I think that if you're looking for just a solid runaround, for £900 with the work done and most of a year's MOT that car would be perfectly acceptable. However, while a well-kept 200k mile TDI should have plenty of life left in it, if your intention is a base for restoration and/or major upgrade, you might indeed want to think about a lower mileage/full history/not categorised car.

Either way round, if you wanted you could get a better front bumper shell and the crash bar behind it which is probably slightly bent (hence the bump and the crack in the shell) and fit them yourself. That silver is the most common A2 colour, so one of our ethical breakers would probably be able to help soon enough. Ditto with better headlights, although those ones are probably splittable so you could dry and reseal them. The false floor and load cover in Swing grey are not hard to come by either. You could also sort out the stereo with the better second-generation A2 headunit, which would require a little wiring work. I'm sure all the information will already be on here, but if you were to engage @timmus for this he would know exactly what he's doing and be able to help you with any other common electrical issues such as door locks. It's just all extra costs, but when you drive an A2 you'll soon feel that the little things it might need to bring it up to scratch are worth doing.
 
So now you need to see another to compare and check you are getting the best for your money 😉

I've used this site in the past to save searching ebay etc individually.

audi a2 - NewsNow Classifieds

Find the best offers for audi a2 here quickly!
www.newsnow.co.uk

Only problem. I haven't sussed filtering on location!
 
AndyBa said:
So now you need to see another to compare and check you are getting the best for your money 😉

I've used this site in the past to save searching ebay etc individually.

audi a2 - NewsNow Classifieds

Find the best offers for audi a2 here quickly!
www.newsnow.co.uk

Only problem. I haven't sussed filtering on location!
Click to expand...
I didn't know about that site. Only showing 4 A2's but the OP @rain.parade might be interested in the 4th one a 2002 Audi A2 1.4 TDI MOT JULY 2024 167K selling on gumtree for £995 in Ratby just on the outskirts of Leicester - 125 miles from OP. Nice rarer colour (Castle Red?)
 
Alan_uk said:
I didn't know about that site. Only showing 4 A2's but the OP @rain.parade might be interested in the 4th one a 2002 Audi A2 1.4 TDI MOT JULY 2024 167K selling on gumtree for £995 in Ratby just on the outskirts of Leicester - 125 miles from OP. Nice rarer colour (Castle Red?)
Click to expand...
There's more than 4. It has annoying blanks scroll down further. There will be some repeats (30+days), some may have old bids displayed and FB Marketplace isn't listed.
 
Alan_uk said:
I didn't know about that site. Only showing 4 A2's but the OP @rain.parade might be interested in the 4th one a 2002 Audi A2 1.4 TDI MOT JULY 2024 167K selling on gumtree for £995 in Ratby just on the outskirts of Leicester - 125 miles from OP. Nice rarer colour (Castle Red?)
Click to expand...
A word to the wise, don't go near any A2 being sold from that location, it's unlikely to be all that it seems. The seller is banned from this site for dishonest dealings, and was also booted out of all but his own Facebook A2 group.
 
Proghound said:
A word to the wise, don't go near any A2 being sold from that location, it's unlikely to be all that it seems. The seller is banned from this site for dishonest dealings, and was also booted out of all but his own Facebook A2 group.
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Yeah, I had seen that ad on his FB group, which was partly what gave me pause on the one I looked at, but I'd already read a few old posts suggesting needing to be cautious there, as you say (I like to do my research, and the internet's great for that!) Looks like he's already taken a deposit on it in any case.
 
Proghound said:
You're right, those aren't original A2 rims, they are at least reasonably sympathetic though. Another consideration for you - I notice it's an early TDI, was it on an X or a Y plate under the masking? If it's a Y then no problem, but remember that all X-plated TDI's were registered before 1st March 2001 so they are are subject to vehicle tax at £200 annual rate, not £35. I notice too that it's a 5-seater. If you don't actually need three rear seats (only one of which can actually take a child seat) then a 4-seater is a much more flexible arrangement and a lot easer to get into 'van mode'.

All of that said, I think that if you're looking for just a solid runaround, for £900 with the work done and most of a year's MOT that car would be perfectly acceptable. However, while a well-kept 200k mile TDI should have plenty of life left in it, if your intention is a base for restoration and/or major upgrade, you might indeed want to think about a lower mileage/full history/not categorised car.

Either way round, if you wanted you could get a better front bumper shell and the crash bar behind it which is probably slightly bent (hence the bump and the crack in the shell) and fit them yourself. That silver is the most common A2 colour, so one of our ethical breakers would probably be able to help soon enough. Ditto with better headlights, although those ones are probably splittable so you could dry and reseal them. The false floor and load cover in Swing grey are not hard to come by either. You could also sort out the stereo with the better second-generation A2 headunit, which would require a little wiring work. I'm sure all the information will already be on here, but if you were to engage @timmus for this he would know exactly what he's doing and be able to help you with any other common electrical issues such as door locks. It's just all extra costs, but when you drive an A2 you'll soon feel that the little things it might need to bring it up to scratch are worth doing.
Click to expand...
Thanks for the comprehensive reply. Yes, it is a Y plate (August 2001) - I wasn't aware of the the tax situation with the earlier ones though, so that's really useful to know, going forwards. And no, I don't need the five seater, and although not the end of the world, that was a mark against the car I looked at from my perspective.

For me, the idea is that the A2 would be a more practical 2nd car to use along side my New Beetle. I'm happy getting stuck into incremental improvements (e.g. the bumper replacement), but I don't really have the time, nor critically the outside space, for major upgrade works. I guess my concern is that if I were to spend say £3k on a much tidier, lower milage A2 with a better history, it's still a 20+ year old car to which expensive things could happen, so in some ways a cheap one is tempting in that there's less be lost if a terminal fault were to develop!
 
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