Webasto

bretti_kivi said:
@jupis: yep, there is (as I understand - I run a petrol and can't afford the €800 for a burner and installation) - a cable / relay to turn the fan on. It's the fan that eats most of the power and that's why I'd also suggest not using the heating too much or installing a defa charger / second battery / whatever. The general suggestion is to let it run as long as you're going to drive.

@mclaine - I will have to look for the remote control, but I think they're expensive. Have you googled for the GSM Control stuff? I'm sure there's a Finn who has already done this somewhere.

I also feel a meet coming on in summer... Pulkkilan Harju, anyone? (great driving roads, not necessarily so in winter...)

Bret
Click to expand...

I think timer is enough for me -as you said remote controller can be expensive. Cost of 300 euros for webasto park heating is maximum that I've thought to invest.. And installation to be done myself.

Climate right now at this altitude is: -5 degrees, wind 20 m/s, snowing, dark --> I think very similar to Lahti.... My A2 is normally in warm carage but leaving from work after 8 hours... Would be very nice to have this park heating.
Okay A2 meeting at Pulkkilan Harju.. Where is info found about this meeting?
 
Today I tried the Econ button so webasto was not started. It was a warm day +1 deg so I had enough heat to the interior and the engine had solid temperature of 90 deg. In similar days I have heard the webasto sound when I turn off a fully warmed engine so it seems webasto is always on when outer temperature is cold enough, even if there is no need for extra heat.

If this is the case, I guess I it is worth switching to econ mode for long travels etc when the webasto is mostly unnecessary. Does somebody know if this conclusion is true, i.e., the webasto is producing heat the whole time while driving? :confused:
 
Comes on when exterior temp is less than 7c regardless of anything else. Econ switch turns the Webasto off - overrides the 7c switch on.
 
jupis said:
Does somebody know if this conclusion is true, i.e., the webasto is producing heat the whole time while driving? :confused:
Click to expand...
Well, as maersk said, the Webasto does automatically switch on at 6 or 7 degC but according to the technical spec -
''The system is started or switched off by an integral control unit acting on switching criteria (eg coolant temperature) from the engine control unit.
The different temps in the system, eg flame temp and the water temp are monitored by sensors and regulated accordingly by the control unit.''
I'm not convinced but this suggests the the heater output varies, dependent on temperature.
On my car it only seems to increase fuel consumption by the odd mpg so I just leave it to its own devices.

Cheers Spike
PS It would appear I only live just up the road from maersk
 
Last edited:
Thank you for sharing this information. It is a relief to hear A2 has a system of turning webasto also off if not needed. It might just be the turning-off criterion is just a bit high in the sense that it is sometimes operating even if not absolutely needed.

I don't really have a long experience with my A2 yet, so I let the webasto do its work and keep watching from the side if I can sometimes hear it has not been operating when I turn off a fully-warmed engine.
 
These days I seem to hear the Webasto more than what I can remember over the years. (mine is a diesel powered one and not a new electric one). So I tried the ECON button over the weekend and indeed it did switch it off after a minute or so... In all the 7 years of owning the car I never knew I could do that. But then why would you NOT want the heat when it is that cold?!

But I'm still unclear if the Webasto EVER switches off with the temperature below 5 degrees? I was in and out of the car and it came on every time I started the car and drove off regardless of the temperature gauge saying the car's engine was already warm. Or does it just go on after starting and I just don't notice it switching off?

I just wish there was a way of switching it ON! Sometimes it is just above 5 degrees or even 10 degress but for whatever reason I'm freezing and want heat there and then!!! Alas you have to wait ages for the engine to heat up. Is there no special sequence of buttons one can press to get it going? Or is the remote control way the only way to go?
 
When the engine is switched off it usually takes rather long time before the webasto is turned off as it is actively doing something, like it would be necessary to make some preparations before shutting down the heater.

My guess is that webasto is not always heating while driving but if it has been switched on during the drive it will go through this shutting-down routine when the engine is finally switched off.

I have also been thinking how the timer is really working. It would be wonderful if one could make a simple circuit that ignites the webasto manually. That's the feature I'm missing in my car :)
 
Jupis: Igniting the Webasto manually would be useful but then there is the danger of igniting it without the engine running and therefore no coolant being circulated. 6 years ago having just bought my A2 Tdi I asked the Webasto service agents in Trafford Park, Manchester about converting the Webasto to run on demand, especially for pre-heating the engine. There were threads on this site at that time. They had not done one but were keen to have a go (several days work and several hundred pounds) since they had the German instructions. A separate coolant circulating pump is needed. I was tempted but decided not to go ahead.
 
Thank you for pointing this out Paul. Indeed if that is the principle, then it doesn't make sense without having an extra pump for coolant circulation and that explains why the whole modification kit is required to make use of webasto without engine running.:eek:
 
Finally retrofitted timer to the heater

In the last few days I have been busy with retrofitting a timer and a GSM-unit to the additional heater on my beloved A2. After a lot of preparation, going over the installation manuals and studying it closely, it was time to get to work. Disassembling cover panels and glove box was easy. Getting to the power near the ECU; easy. Fitting the circulation pump: easy.
I knew that my Webasto had stopped working again before I started, so I had to take it out of the car for cleaning. This was not so easy. It is quite hard to get the tools in place, and the clamps for the hoses are a bit tricky to get of if the tools cant get to it. So I used my Dremel-tool with an extension cord and cut them of. I later replaced the clamps with new ones. Once the heater was out, I cleaned the glow plug. Then my brother who works with diesel engines and heater systems took a closer look at the burner element. It was completely charcoaled and we gave it a cleaning with a brass brush attached to the Dremel tool. Now it was time to put it all back together.

The wiring bundle has a relay and to fuse holders. From this a lead with a black and a white/green goes to the 6-pin socket on the heather. I had to remove the air intake, the sensor cluster for the turbo an a thin ALU heat shield to get to the place where the wires goes from the booth to the engine room. Fairly straight forward.

Black wire to pin 1 on heater (This gives a signal from the timer to start the heater)
Green/white wire to pin 4 on heater (This gives the relay the start signal to start the interior fan and optionally there is a single green/white wire to pin 10 on the Climate Control unit. If there is no climate control, isolate and ignore it.)
Done with wires to the heater.

Next, the wires to the interior fan. The 6-pin connector on the fan contains a green/red wire. Pull it out and connect it to the red wire on the red and black pair. The black wire goes in to the slot where the green/red came out of.
Done with the wires to the interior fan.

Next, connect the brown wire to the ground point near the relays at the lower A-pillar area. Stretch the single red cable all the way to the ECU-area, connect it to the fuse from the kit and then to the plus power. (BTW, disconnect the battery BEFORE doing anything).
Done with power supply.

Find a good place for the timer and connect the last wire bundle to it.

Done! Lets fire it up.

WTF??? The fan on the heater starts up, but it does not start. Well, i didn't honestly think it would go smoothly. My brother and I started troubleshooting. We noticed that the relay didn't get any signal, and the metering pump (fuel pump) did not get power. OK, we took out the pump and checked it. After some fiddling we deduced that the pump works fine. We took some pressured air and blew through the fuel line. There were some dirt, but we cleaned it out. Hmmm. Still no go. We searched several forums on the topic, and someone mentioned that the outdoor temp sensor had to be cooled down. I grabbed a shovel and found some snow and packed the sensor. Still nothing. Only the air blower would run, but no fire. Maybe the controller unit inside the heater was broken? The unit is suppose to send the signal to the pump and relay, but nothing is being sent. Hmmmm....

After a good Christmas dinner and some searching on the web, I decided to hook up my Vag-Com and see if there was any fault-codes that needed to be cleared. Nah... nothing. Then we asked ourselves: Why isn't the heater getting fuel? We pealed of the fuel hose on the heater and used the Vag-Com to start the metering pump.
*Golden Vag-Com tip: 18. Aux. Heating => 3. Output tests => Start
Yes! The pump primed the fuel line and we were getting fuel all the way to the heater.( Had to do this 3 times before fuel came out up at the burner.) Then we took pressured air to the fuel intake on the heater. Sh**! Completely clogged. I sprayed in some WD-40, waited a few minutes and pressed 8 bar of air to the intake. Poff! Success. Now the heater was open again! We assembled it and used Vag-Com to start the heater manually.
*Vag-Com tip: 18. Aux. Heating => 4. Basic tests => Group 22 => Go!

Woha!! The heater started to prime and burn at once.

This story is not only about retrofitting a timer, but also to revive at dead heater.

At the end I fitted the Thermo Call Connect 2 unit with GSM antenna and programmed it.
Easy part.

Feel free to ask for more details. Unfortunately I didn't take pictures...
 
Wohaa, nice mod and write up Newton. Glad you did it and also got the heater serviced at the same time. I guess it would be perfect to do the mod while replacing the cam belt as you get more room for your arms/tools.

I'll make the same mod (hopefully this summer) so I'll make sure to be prepared with the shutter and snap the ones you missed while trailing fine tracks ;-)

First mod though is to install a Bluetooth kit for the RNS-E navi <-> iPhone. I'll also try to enable SDS (speech commands) and video in motion so I can install a MacBook for AV-media/internet/instant VAG-Com etc.
 
Aftermath...

Yup. I found out that I paid a bit too much compared to buy it from i.e. eBay.

What you need is the wireing loom:
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/NEW-WEBASTO-W...14&_trkparms=72:1301|66:2|65:12|39:1|240:1318

The timer
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/WEBASTO-TIMER...14&_trkparms=72:1301|66:2|65:12|39:1|240:1318

The waterpump:
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/WATER-PUMP-WE...14&_trkparms=72:1301|66:2|65:12|39:1|240:1318

And some colant hoses and joints...

Now I know how to install it, and soon my friends A2 will have a nice warm car too... :)
 
nr.1, check the battery!

After observing the Webasto being totally unresponsive for the last few days at -10C, today i took the battery for a quick charge and see if it would revive the crucial heating unit. Popped the battery back and gave it a try, only to see a huge cloud of smoke engulfing the front end of the car. The heater started to spew thick white smoke all over the place like never before. This went on for almost 10 minutes. The car started to heat up eventually and the smoke became clear. It's now working ok, but should i expect a failure in the near future?
 
Hi trex
The smoke is likely to be unburnt diesel which accumulated in the Webasto while it was not working. When it did fire up the excess fuel would vapourise and come out as white smoke until correct combustion was achieved. This in itself should not result in long term damage.

Cheers Spike
 
trex said:
After observing the Webasto being totally unresponsive for the last few days at -10C, today i took the battery for a quick charge and see if it would revive the crucial heating unit. Popped the battery back and gave it a try, only to see a huge cloud of smoke engulfing the front end of the car. The heater started to spew thick white smoke all over the place like never before. This went on for almost 10 minutes. The car started to heat up eventually and the smoke became clear. It's now working ok, but should i expect a failure in the near future?
Click to expand...

Hi Trex,

I too have had my Webasto fail and then mysteriously come back to life after fitting a new battery. Still working two winters later :)

John.
 
Re: Trex and Poor John

Interesting that the heater came to life again after disconnecting and connecting the battery. When I was fitting the timer unit I came across some interesting reading in the workshop repairmanual for the heater. If the heater has several blow-outs and wont restart again it goes in to a lock-down. To clear this you will have to remove the fuse to the heater for a few seconds. This will reset the heater to normal again. Disconnecting the battery will do the same trick. According to the servicemanual the heater will work at voltages down to 12,5, so I don't think an old battery is of any concern... But you never know....
 
Now that the summer is coming I'm thinking about engine heaters :) The electrical defa heater for 1.4 TDI's is 411761 (http://www.defa.com/finn_dok_h.php3?merke=AUDI&modell=A2&type=2&lang=3&ndid=) so it seems to me this is a coolant heater not an engine block as for petrol model.

Has somebody installed this product? I guess it circulates the coolant by itself, please correct me if I'm wrong. I heard from my friend that for some cars the heater can cause engine not to start due to temperature sensor being too close to the heater. Does somebody know if there is a risk like this in case of A2?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top