Tyre choices?

A2Dreamer

A2OC Donor
Hi all,

Just about to fork out for a complete set of tyres...

Think I've narrowed the choice down to:

Avon AS7 All season C B rated

OR

Bridgestone A005 weather control evo C A rated

Size will either be 185/65 15, or 195/60 15.

Prices are similar (Bridgestone slightly more expensive..). £55 - £60 range...

Both tyres are all season.

Just wondering if anyone's running these or got any experience/feedback?

Any thoughts much appreciated.

Any other recommendations?

Kind regards

Pete
 

Providence

Member
I'm running Bridgestone Turanza T005 195/60 15 on my 1.4 Sport. I have found them grippy in wet ot dry.

I know theses are summer tyres but I live in Sussex and we never get any snow!

I bit the bullet and replaced all four when got the wheels and find everything better than when I was running 215/40 17 with Kumho LE Sports.
 

A2Dreamer

A2OC Donor
Thanks Providence...

I assume you're on 15 x 6J wheels?

Are the 195 fractionally too wide or are they just right?

Cheers

Pete
 

carlston

Well-Known Member
Hi all,

Just about to fork out for a complete set of tyres...

Think I've narrowed the choice down to:

Avon AS7 All season C B rated

OR

Bridgestone A005 weather control evo C A rated

Size will either be 185/65 15, or 195/60 15.

Prices are similar (Bridgestone slightly more expensive..). £55 - £60 range...

Both tyres are all season.

Just wondering if anyone's running these or got any experience/feedback?

Any thoughts much appreciated.

Any other recommendations?

Kind regards

Pete

The Euro labels are self certified, so don't take much notice of them.

For example, the Avon AS7 all-season tyre came in last place for rolling resistance, ie. fuel consumption, in this 2021 all-season tyre review. Avon clearly shouldn't have given themselves a C rating for rolling resistance...maybe an F at best.

Overall, Avon came in last place except for the star performer, that was simply thrown into the review to show how bad a tyre can get.


Any of the top 6 placed all-season tyres in the review are good.

Two of the most interesting charts in the review are the wet braking tests for both mild temperatures and cold temperatures. Looking at the braking distances for each tyre, you can see how the braking distance increases as the temperature drops. For example, the braking distance for the summer tyre increases by about 40% as the temperature drops.
 
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A2Dreamer

A2OC Donor
Thanks Carlston,

That's really useful input. I had absolutely no idea that the ratings are self certified!

I'd assumed there was some rigor behind the testing, but obviously not. Completely devalues the information...

Ho hum!!
 

Providence

Member
Thanks Providence...

I assume you're on 15 x 6J wheels?

Are the 195 fractionally too wide or are they just right?

Cheers

Pete
The width seems fine to me. I have not had any rubbing on full lock or when the car is loaded down. They're 15" but not sure if they're 6J. I got them from A2Steve with 205s on them. I believe they are A1 Ronals.
 

dj_efk

A2OC Donor
Do not buy Avon tyres. They are poor performers and poor quality - they are well-known for cracking within just a year or two of manufacture!

I am not sure if they are still made in the UK or not, if not then that may explain something.

Honestly I’d advocate buying almost anything over Avon.
 

carlston

Well-Known Member
185/65R15 and 195/60R15 are both significantly oversize, so will raise the gearing by quite a bit.

Outside diameter
175/60R15 591mm
185/65R15 621.5mm
195/60R15 615mm

So compared to the standard 175/60R15 tyre size, 185/65R15 will raise the gearing by 5.2% and 195/60R15 will raise the gearing by 4.1%. These are big increases that you will notice. For example, 4th gear may not pull quite so well around town at 30mph.

If you want this much sidewall, it may be best to fit 14" rims with tyre sizes such as 185/65R14 and 195/60R14. Both these tyre sizes will keep the gearing standard as the outside diameter of these tyre sizes is the same as 165/65R15 and 175/60R15.

With the 15" tyre sizes, it may be best to stick to sizes such as 185/60R15 and 195/55R15...at least then you keep the gearing close to standard.

195/45R16 has been used on the A2, and 175/65R14 and 185/55R15 both have the same outside diameter. 175/65R14 is a particularly cheap tyre size. 185/55R15 could be used on the standard 5.5Jx15 ET34 rims that normally have the 175/60R15 tyre size fitted. 185/55R15 tyres fitted to 5.5J rims is a standard size on the VW Up!. 185/55R15 could also be used on 6J rims with offsets such as ET29, ET35, ET38, etc.

Uniroyal RainExpert 5 175/65R14 82T
208629-215443-main--8858.jpg


Uniroyal RainSport 5 185/55R15 82H
188166-194980-main--7674.jpg

 
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Hoomart

Member
185/65R15 and 195/60R15 are both significantly oversize, so will raise the gearing by quite a bit. Outside diameter 175/60R15 591mm 185/65R15 621.5mm 195/60R15 615mm So compared to the standard 175/60R15 tyre size, 185/65R15 will raise the gearing by 5.2% and 195/60R15 will raise the gearing by 4.1%. These are big increases that you will notice. For example, 4th gear may not pull quite so well around town at 30mph. If you want this much sidewall, it may be best to fit 14" rims with tyre sizes such as 185/65R14 and 195/60R14. Both these tyre sizes will keep the gearing standard as the outside diameter of these tyre sizes is the same as 165/65R15 and 175/60R15. With the 15" tyre sizes, it may be best to stick to sizes such as 185/60R15 and 195/55R15...at least then you keep the gearing close to standard. 195/45R16 has been used on the A2, and 175/65R14 and 185/55R15 both have the same outside diameter. 175/65R14 is a particularly cheap tyre size. 185/55R15 could be used on the standard 5.5Jx15 ET34 rims that normally have the 175/60R15 tyre size fitted. 185/55R15 tyres fitted to 5.5J rims is a standard size on the VW Up!. Uniroyal RainExpert 5 175/65R14 82T Uniroyal RainExpert 5 185/65R14 86T Uniroyal RainSport 5 185/55R15 82H
Hi all, Just about to fork out for a complete set of tyres... Think I've narrowed the choice down to: Avon AS7 All season C B rated OR Bridgestone A005 weather control evo C A rated Size will either be 185/65 15, or 195/60 15. Prices are similar (Bridgestone slightly more expensive..). £55 - £60 range... Both tyres are all season. Just wondering if anyone's running these or got any experience/feedback? Any thoughts much appreciated. Any other recommendations? Kind regards Pete
 

Leopard680

Member
Alison does a lot of mileage so I don't buy budget rubber. She has a set of Michelin Crossclimate 2 tyres. They are excellent. As far as I am aware, they're unique for All Season Tyres in being certified as suitable for Snow with the Three Peaks symbol on them. ?
 

Hoomart

Member
Hi there to you all ; I hope you don't mind me posting this, but I do know an awful lot about tyres & not much about anything else & it really supprises me how people look at buying tyres ; it is without a doubt price driven, which I understand, but honestly, you cannot do better than spend a resonable amount on them, as they really are the defining component on how a car rides, handles, brakes, steers, sounds & uses fuel.

I worked for Goodyear (also owners of many brands (Dunlop, Fulda, Sava & others) as an original equipment test driver for over 30 years & I can assure you that it is a tough business, as even the OEM's don't want to pay for anything !!

So my point is this ; OEMs & suppliers work hard to get the best tyre possible, for several years before any car is launched onto the public. The selection of tyre sizes are an integral part of the initial package & affect may things ; weight, wheel envelope, relating to wheel arch clearance, steering lock requiements, ride height, snow chain clearance etc, fuel consumption to name a few.

We (tyre suppliers) work with them to meet these & other requirements - comfort, NVH, handling braking, wet grip, rolling resistance & so on & finally the 'best' are chosen to be suppliers on a technical level, then the price war begins. The 'best' performers do not always get the business !!

So, basically, my advice is please stick to the OEM tyre sizes & you have a chance of getting close to the OEM performance criteria, to match the vehicle, especially if you stick to the big names - GY Dunlop, Pirelli, Conti, Michelin, Bridgestone to name a few. This is particularly true when a car, such as the A2, uses non popular sizes ; this means that a tyre you buy in the 'correct' size may actually still be the original OE approved construction !!

I understand everyone is on a budget & tyres are one of the highest running cost of a car, but the fact remains, especially in countries that use the Certificate of Conformity (CoC) as a reference for giving a valid MOT pass, it will invalidate your insurance if you do not use the OEM dimensions or have an approved exception to the CoC tyre sizes, eg when the size is no longer made.

If you can't or don't want to stick to the OE sizes, then the things to consider as a minimum are ; The OD should be close to the original for speedo accuracy, the speed index should be at least as high as the OE tyre, the load index should meet or exceed the OE tyre & the rim width you use should be 'legal' - that is to say within the ETRTO allowable sizes for any particular size of tyre. Things such as wheel arch clearance, reduction in steering lock, due to touching on other suspension parts etc. are not 'illegal' as such, but a keen inspector may reject a car for these types of problems, along with exposed wheel rim flanges, due to small tyres fitted on wide rims for that 'cruisin' look'.

As far as the driving experience of the car goes ; tracking under acceleration or on bumpy roads, general steering feel and feedback, comfort, noise and fuel consumption are almost inevitably worse when fitting larger sized tyres, versus the OE sizes & often, even the largest OE approved size works less well than the 'medium' size approved size, but does meet the requirements of the OE Marketing departments need for pretty pictures for the brochures !!

Sorry for the long winded post (not intended as a lecture !), but a tyre makes or breaks the car & often, the people who travel in them !!!

Yours, MartinH
 

A2Dreamer

A2OC Donor
Wow!

Thanks for the great feedback guys..

dj_efk, interesting on Avon, one to be avoided then!!

Carlston, I'm happy to be oversizing these a bit, accepting that it may blunt performance a touch but sacrificing that for slightly lower gearing.

Leopard680, I've been looking at the crossclimates and have been veering (hoho) towards them. Good to have another solid recommendation...

Cheers all.

Pete
 

Leopard680

Member
Wow!

Thanks for the great feedback guys..

dj_efk, interesting on Avon, one to be avoided then!!

Carlston, I'm happy to be oversizing these a bit, accepting that it may blunt performance a touch but sacrificing that for slightly lower gearing.

Leopard680, I've been looking at the crossclimates and have been veering (hoho) towards them. Good to have another solid recommendation...

Cheers all.

Pete
Glad you found the information useful, Pete.

I've run Winter Tyres on Alison; Pirelli Snow Control. Thing is, after I bought them, we had a run of exceptionally mild winters!

So I thought I'd try something different. As soon as Crossclimate 2 became available in the size I needed, I didn't hesitate to order them.

So far, I've northing but praise for them. Low rolling resistance is improving fuel consumption too! All round win.

I bought these after doing lots of research. I also had the Crossclimate Plus on an A3 before, so they're not unfamiliar! ? ? ? ? ? ?
 

miniswift

A2OC Donor
Hi,
I used to use Vredestein for my better halfs Polo BlueMotion.
It used to drive up steep hill in Stanley when all other cars were stranded at the bottom.
Not sure how expensive they are for A2 but tyres are only item between you and road. Buy the best you can afford.

Cheers
Atchi
 

A2Dreamer

A2OC Donor
Hey Hoomart, that's great input also and much appreciated.

I absolutely agree with you and have no problem spending cash where appropriate, particularly on the four (very limited) contact patches with the road, so it's great to get feedback like this also.

As you note though, the car manufacturers select the 'best' tyres, then the 'value ' engineering starts. In my view, value engineering engineers the value out of things!!

The a2 (as with many cars) was fitted with a multitude of wheel and tyre sizes, possibly with varying spring/damper rates (and possibly not).

The engineering around the a2 is by no means perfect, and (again, as with many cars) there's room for improvement in many areas.

I think it's all about being proportional, sensible and pragmatic where we're making alterations to our cars, whether it's a remap / proboost, tyres, central armrest, going back to cast front arms in place of the steel ones (that were presumably introduced as part of a value engineering package..!!) Etc..

I truly believe that this sort of discussion is the strength of a forum like this, where we can bounce ideas around and keep older cars on the road. Sustainability through longevity. None of this nonsense around rushing out and getting a new car every few years!!

Or electric cars, which may generate lower point (or country) of use CO2 emissions, but are wholly unsustainable. I think that's a whole new topic though, so I'll stop there before properly taking the lid off that can of worms...
 
@Hoomart thank you for your post

My issue is I bought my car in 2009; it was 5 years old. I have no idea what the OEM tyres would have been

My wheels are the factory supplied Ronal “5-Stern” 6J X 16 H2 ET35

I recently (Oct-2021) switched all four tyres to Vredestein Quatrac D/B/70 185/50 R16 81H; very pleased with them so far. Camskill offered the best price and availability

(My OEM space saver run flat spare is fitted with Vredestein rubber, in this case Space Master 155/70-16 78P …no doubt, long past it’s best before date)

Andrew
 

A2Z

A2OC Donor
@Hoomart thank you for your post

My issue is I bought my car in 2009; it was 5 years old. I have no idea what the OEM tyres would have been

My wheels are the factory supplied Ronal “5-Stern” 6J X 16 H2 ET35

I recently (Oct-2021) switched all four tyres to Vredestein Quatrac D/B/70 185/50 R16 81H; very pleased with them so far. Camskill offered the best price and availability

(My OEM space saver run flat spare is fitted with Vredestein rubber, in this case Space Master 155/70-16 78P …no doubt, long past it’s best before date)

Andrew
The tyres you bought are the correct size for your car as I'm sure you are aware, the only difference being the original tyres fitted to the car when it was new (which would have been what Audi could get the best deal on at the time) would have been a 'V' speed rating rather than 'H' but this will have no effect to you in the real world as H is good for 130mph whilst V is 149 and I don't see any of us doing that kind of speed in our A2's any time soon?
 

Hoomart

Member
Good point @A2Z , speed rating is another key factor that l forgot to mention !!
As you rightly say , even the fastest standard A2 will get nowhere near the max authorised speed of an H rated tyre, on the flat, but manufactuers , especially German, always err on the side or caution, given there are some quite steep downhill sections of still unlimited Autobahn where some petrolheads see what there cars will do !
I once saw an indicated 345 km/h on such a section, when testing an Aston Virage Vantage, many years ago ?.
The other thing is that most tyre manufactures have less aggressive tread designs for their T rated tyres & the OEMs often want more sporty designs, which forces them to specify H & above speed rated tyres without needing the speed capacity.

It is however technically illegal to fit lower speed rated tyres than what the original fitment tyre had !!! Unless you have a warning sticker on the speedo stating the new limit the tyres fitted now have.

MartinH
 

A2Z

A2OC Donor
Good point @A2Z , speed rating is another key factor that l forgot to mention !!
As you rightly say , even the fastest standard A2 will get nowhere near the max authorised speed of an H rated tyre, on the flat, but manufactuers , especially German, always err on the side or caution, given there are some quite steep downhill sections of still unlimited Autobahn where some petrolheads see what there cars will do !
I once saw an indicated 345 km/h on such a section, when testing an Aston Virage Vantage, many years ago ?.
The other thing is that most tyre manufactures have less aggressive tread designs for their T rated tyres & the OEMs often want more sporty designs, which forces them to specify H & above speed rated tyres without needing the speed capacity.

It is however technically illegal to fit lower speed rated tyres than what the original fitment tyre had !!! Unless you have a warning sticker on the speedo stating the new limit the tyres fitted now have.

MartinH
Please correct me if I'm wrong but I don't believe it is illegal to fit a tyre with a speed rating mph that is higher than that of the official maximum top speed of a car stated by the car manufacturer?

I do appreciate however that there has to be a tolerance built in for the reason you state above so if for example a car was capable of a maximum top speed of 128mph you wouldn't want to be fitting a 130mph 'H' rated tyre but would step up to the 149mph V to be safe but as the A2 has a published top speed of 107mph (1.4 petrol and tdi) I can't believe that a tyre rated for 130mph could not be legal although I must admit I'm not aware of the legal percentage if there is one but I would have though there must be, although I have to admit it's not something I have ever looked into? ?
 

Hoomart

Member
Please correct me if I'm wrong but I don't believe it is illegal to fit a tyre with a speed rating mph that is higher than that of the official maximum top speed of a car stated by the car manufacturer?

I do appreciate however that there has to be a tolerance built in for the reason you state above so if for example a car was capable of a maximum top speed of 128mph you wouldn't want to be fitting a 130mph 'H' rated tyre but would step up to the 149mph V to be safe but as the A2 has a published top speed of 107mph (1.4 petrol and tdi) I can't believe that a tyre rated for 130mph could not be legal although I must admit I'm not aware of the legal percentage if there is one but I would have though there must be, although I have to admit it's not something I have ever looked into? ?
Hi again, yes you are correct ; fitting higher speed rated and or higher load indexed tyres is not illegal, it's just that (normally) higher speed rated tyres are sold at a higher price, but this is not always the case, as it depends on volumes sold ; higher load index and or higher speed rated tyres may degrade the comfort, as the tyre belt package is more robust, to carry the higher maximum load and reach the higher max speed testing.
 
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